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ralph wilson's children


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#1 Guest_three3_*

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Posted 04 January 2010 - 08:59 PM

how many daughters does he have?  

why does the team have to be sold to the highest bidder when he dies?

why wouldn't one of ralph's daughters be willing to own their dad's team?

#2 DUTE

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Posted 04 January 2010 - 09:11 PM

Im not sure where i heard it from but im pretty sure i heard that his daughters dont have any interest in owning the bills. Also this article from a couple yrs back says something about their being a money issue. Check it out.......

http://buffalonews.t...as-for-ral.html

#3 DonInBuffalo

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Posted 04 January 2010 - 09:11 PM

He has three daughters:
- Linda was the first female NFL scout.  She had cancer and died last year.
- Christine does merchandise consulting for the Bills.
- Edith has no involvement with the Bills.

They have their own lives/careers and aren't interested in becoming NFL owners.

#4 DUTE

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Posted 04 January 2010 - 09:19 PM

As long as they stay in Buffalo i dont even care if jerry jones or al davis is the owner . And they definitely better not end up in toronto! Those toronto bills games were PAINFUL to watch, no atmosphere there just a bunch of dumb canadians. Nothin compares to watchin a game live at The Ralph :flirt:

#5 manateefan

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Posted 04 January 2010 - 09:23 PM

View PostDonInBuffalo, on Jan 4 2010, 09:11 PM, said:

He has three daughters:
- Linda was the first female NFL scout.  She had cancer and died last year.
- Christine does merchandise consulting for the Bills.
- Edith has no involvement with the Bills.

They have their own lives/careers and aren't interested in becoming NFL owners.

Linda would probably been the logical choice of the daughters to take over if she had not gotten sick.

#6 Guest_three3_*

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Posted 04 January 2010 - 09:32 PM

View PostDUTE, on Jan 4 2010, 09:11 PM, said:

Im not sure where i heard it from but im pretty sure i heard that his daughters dont have any interest in owning the bills. Also this article from a couple yrs back says something about their being a money issue. Check it out.......

http://buffalonews.t...as-for-ral.html


and a $270 million estate tax is a problem for the wilsons?  the team is worth over a billion.  ralph paid, what, 2 million to buy the team?  how about his other businesses?  he has to have WELL over a billion in assets

#7 Beastly Dareus

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Posted 04 January 2010 - 09:53 PM

View Postthree3, on Jan 4 2010, 09:32 PM, said:

and a $270 million estate tax is a problem for the wilsons?  the team is worth over a billion.  ralph paid, what, 2 million to buy the team?  how about his other businesses?  he has to have WELL over a billion in assets


The Bills arent worth over a Billion Dollars. According to Sports Business Journal and Forbes the BillS are in the bottom 5 teams in value which the estimate range is somewhere around $820 Million.


http://www.forbes.co...lls_301765.html

#8 DonInBuffalo

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Posted 04 January 2010 - 10:00 PM

View Postthree3, on Jan 4 2010, 09:32 PM, said:

and a $270 million estate tax is a problem for the wilsons?  the team is worth over a billion.  ralph paid, what, 2 million to buy the team?  how about his other businesses?  he has to have WELL over a billion in assets
Actually, he paid $25,000 for the team.  50 years ago, $2 million probably could have bought you a NFL franchise.

$270 million in taxes is a problem for pretty much anybody.  I'm guessing that if you exclude the Bills, his entire estate isn't worth anywhere close to that much.  So on top of factors already mentioned, if he left the team to his children, they would have to sell it just to pay the taxes they owed on it.

#9 Doc

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Posted 04 January 2010 - 10:05 PM

Even if they had the money, the daughters have said that they don't want the team.  But there is a succession plan in place, likely involving Ralph's wife, or maybe a trust.  I don't know, but that's what's been reported.

#10 Guest_three3_*

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Posted 04 January 2010 - 10:07 PM

View PostDoc, on Jan 4 2010, 10:05 PM, said:

Even if they had the money, the daughters have said that they don't want the team.  But there is a succession plan in place, likely involving Ralph's wife, or maybe a trust.  I don't know, but that's what's been reported.


reported by what media outlet?  and do you really think ralph's other enterprises, investments and cold hard cash do not add up to 270 mil?  i have a feeling it exceeds that by a large margin

#11 gmac17

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Posted 04 January 2010 - 10:10 PM

interestingly enough - in 2010 there is no estate tax (due to a quirk / congressional screw up). If Ralph were to die this year - whoever he left the team to could save several hundred million dollars.

Of course, our wonderful congress could come in, pass a law that retroactively changed the estate tax rate (if that's not a reason to hate them, i don't know what is).

#12 Doc

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Posted 04 January 2010 - 10:10 PM

View Postthree3, on Jan 4 2010, 10:07 PM, said:

reported by what media outlet?  and do you really think ralph's other enterprises, investments and cold hard cash do not add up to 270 mil?  i have a feeling it exceeds that by a large margin
Maybe they do add up to $270M.  But guess what?  If he leaves them to his daughters, they get hit with estate tax on those as well.

And Sal Capacchio reported that the Bills have a succession plan in place.  He also reported that the Bills had met with Cowher, when no one else knew about it.

#13 bkc

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Posted 04 January 2010 - 10:13 PM

View Postthree3, on Jan 4 2010, 09:32 PM, said:

and a $270 million estate tax is a problem for the wilsons?  the team is worth over a billion.  ralph paid, what, 2 million to buy the team?  how about his other businesses?  he has to have WELL over a billion in assets
I always wondered with an 820 million dollar asset ,why you couldn't borrow the 270 for the estate tax against the team and pay it off bases on profit.  1o years would clear it up maybe quicker

#14 K Gun Special

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Posted 04 January 2010 - 10:38 PM

View PostDoc, on Jan 4 2010, 10:10 PM, said:

Maybe they do add up to $270M.  But guess what?  If he leaves them to his daughters, they get hit with estate tax on those as well.

And Sal Capacchio reported that the Bills have a succession plan in place.  He also reported that the Bills had met with Cowher, when no one else knew about it.


The plan has been in place for years and years.  Just some people dont use common sense. Ralph is a very on top of it guy, he knows alllll about estate tax and proper entities were created and assets transferred to minimize the impact on his family. Hes very concerned with his legacy and doesnt want to be remembered as the owner who left his team in a mess.

Do you really think a guy worth that much money is just gonna let his estate pass through the fed govt without protecting some of his assets? i mean really?

#15 Doc

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Posted 04 January 2010 - 10:41 PM

View PostK Gun Special, on Jan 4 2010, 10:38 PM, said:

The plan has been in place for years and years.  Just some people dont use common sense. Ralph is a very on top of it guy, he knows alllll about estate tax and proper entities were created and assets transferred to minimize the impact on his family. Hes very concerned with his legacy and doesnt want to be remembered as the owner who left his team in a mess.

Do you really think a guy worst that much money is just gonna let his estate pass through the fed govt without protecting some of his assets? i mean really?
I didn't.  But more than a few people did.  This at least ends the discussion once and for all.  Or, at least until Ralph's heir passes.

#16 DonInBuffalo

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Posted 04 January 2010 - 10:53 PM

View Postbkc, on Jan 4 2010, 10:13 PM, said:

I always wondered with an 820 million dollar asset ,why you couldn't borrow the 270 for the estate tax against the team and pay it off bases on profit.  1o years would clear it up maybe quicker
Probably more like 20-25 at least.  Let's do some very simplistic math:

- Assume the Bills make about $30 million in profit, after taxes, per season.
- Assume they take out a loan for $270 million at 5%.
- So almost half of your profit goes to paying interest you've accumulated that year.  You only have about $16 million to pay down the principle.  So there's no way it would get paid off in 10 years.

#17 zazie

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Posted 04 January 2010 - 11:02 PM

View Postgmac17, on Jan 5 2010, 10:10 AM, said:

interestingly enough - in 2010 there is no estate tax (due to a quirk / congressional screw up). If Ralph were to die this year - whoever he left the team to could save several hundred million dollars.

Of course, our wonderful congress could come in, pass a law that retroactively changed the estate tax rate (if that's not a reason to hate them, i don't know what is).


Unles you are quite rich, the estate tax is a good thing.

Why should these few families control all the wealth forever, because their great great grandparents were good business men (ie robber barons)?

The wealth SHOULD go back into the system, leaving those exposed STILL incredibly rich.

For upper middle class, do some estate planning, most of the money will end up where you want it to.

Personally, it is not important for me to see that RW's heirs get obscene inheritance wealth for doing no work.

Anyway, sadly, it does affect the progression of ownership for the Bills and therefore likely does have a negative impact on the ability for the Wilsons to keep the Bills in BUffalo.  The hope that the FO and Jim Kelly have generated that there is a succession plane to keep the Bills in Buffalo is merely a ruse to keep season ticketholders buying for another year or 2, until RW dies.  Kelly is a dupe or complicit; either way.

Then, the moving trucks won't be able to pull up fast enough the Bills will hightail it to Toronto or LA.

But, keep your hopes up anything can happen.

#18 gobillsinytown

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Posted 04 January 2010 - 11:05 PM

Since Ralph's businesses are private, there's no real way to determine their total net worth.  I don't know anything at all about the guy other that what I read.  But one thing that can be reasonably inferred is that he is good with money.
Ralph grew up during the Great Depression, so one can assume that he's conservative with his money.  I would assume that he avoided the traps that caught so many people during this near depression, like investing in sub prime mortgages, credit default swaps, etc.  So based on this, you could make the assumption that he's got a succession plan in place.
There will also be tremendous polical pressure to keep the team in Buffalo.  
I know lots of uninformed people on this board think he's cheap, but he didn't get rich by being stupid with his money.
He's a miser because he grew up in the worst financial crash in American history.
No one has been able to convince me that lavish spending produces a consistent winner.  The Redskins are the prime example.  Snyder has been throwing money at that team since he bought it, bringing in big name free agents and "name" coaches.  If Shannahan signs with the team, I think the result is going to be the same.
Jerry Jones has been doing the same thing.  So far, his return on investment has been lousy.
One of the more "miserly" organizations in the league just won the Superbowl last year.
I could go on.  Ralph may be cheap, but he's not stupid with his money.  
I think that, if he can swing it, he'll try to keep the team in Bufalo after he dies.

#19 K Gun Special

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Posted 04 January 2010 - 11:08 PM

View PostDoc, on Jan 4 2010, 10:41 PM, said:

I didn't.  But more than a few people did.  This at least ends the discussion once and for all.  Or, at least until Ralph's heir passes.


true
But if you think about it the idea is ridiculous. Assume for a minute the daughters did want the team. theyd still be faced with the dilemma assuming there was no plan in place. Now think of all the sports teams owned by families, that pass down through the generations....theres a few.  They get by through the use of estate planning and trust entities. Its very complicated and highly specialized fields.    
People with that much wealth just dont let it get fully taxed, they take advantage of the law and maximize the money theyve earned.

#20 Doc

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Posted 04 January 2010 - 11:09 PM

View Postzazie, on Jan 4 2010, 11:02 PM, said:

The hope that the FO and Jim Kelly have generated that there is a succession plane to keep the Bills in Buffalo is merely a ruse to keep season ticketholders buying for another year or 2, until RW dies.  Kelly is a dupe or complicit; either way.
Please. :flirt: