91 replies to this topic

[Edwards' Arm]

Over the last 40 years, the Bills have used 25% of their first picks of the draft on RBs, and another 25% on DBs. The Bills' decision to use fully 50% of their first picks of the draft on RBs and DBs is one of the reasons why this team has traditionally had a losing record.

(Note that the concept of a first pick of the draft is not interchangeable with a first round pick. Jim Kelly, for example, was a first round pick. But he wasn't the Bills' first pick of the draft, because the Bills chose a TE two picks earlier.)

During the post-Polian/pre-Nix era, the Bills have used first picks of the draft on the following DBs:

• Thomas Smith. Result: seven years of decent play
  
• Jeff Burris. Result: left the team after four years. Had a ten year career.
  
• Antoine Winfield. Result: left the team after five years. Had a thirteen year career.
  
• Nate Clements. Result: left the team after six years. Has had an eleven year career thus far.
  
• Donte Whitner. Result: bust
  
• Leodis McKelvin. Result: bust

There are no success stories on the above list. Some of the DBs left early because they were busts, and some left early because the team decided to let them go first-contract-and-out. Either way, first round DBs didn't stay long. The Bills responded by using early picks on the replacements for those DBs.

In the post-Polian/pre-Nix era, the Bills have used first picks of the draft on the following RBs:

• Antowain Smith. Result: bust
  
• Willis McGahee. Result: disappointment
  
• Marshawn Lynch. Result: bust

The above list would be longer if it included Travis Henry (second round) and Spiller (a Nix pick). Also, Butler only used one first or second round pick on a RB, which means he used early picks on RBs at a much lower rate than TD or Marv. (Which is one of the things Butler did right.) Needless to say, there are no success stories on the above list.

I'm not suggesting that it's always a mistake for a team to use a first round pick on a RB or DB. If Antoine Winfield, for example, had been retained for the entirety of his career, he would have represented an excellent use of the Bills' first round pick. The reason Antoine Winfield didn't become a success story for the Bills was because of their strategy of allowing their best DBs to go first-contract-and-out.

During the post-Polian era, the Bills have had severe problems at QB and on the offensive line. They used three first round picks on the QB position: Rob Johnson, Drew Bledsoe, and JP Losman. One of those was a trade for another team's aging backup, and did not represent a real effort to find a long-term solution to the problem at QB. That means just two first round picks were used on attempts to find a long-term answer at quarterback, as opposed to nine on DBs + RBs. Similarly, only two first round picks were used on OTs during the post-Polian era, despite the fact the Bills' offensive line has typically been disappointing at best during that time.

Bill from NYC's opposition to using early picks on RBs or DBs is a rational response to the last 20 years of Bills' history. The number of early picks used on those positions has been excessive, and not once during the post-Polian/pre-Nix era has any first round DB or RB resulted in a success story. The team has had very severe problems elsewhere--especially at QB and on the OL--because too many picks were squandered on RBs and DBs.

But just because Nix has used first round picks on a RB and a DB, does not necessarily mean he's falling into the same trap as his predecessors. One of the reasons the post-Polian first round RBs were busts was because none of them were anything special at catching passes out of the backfield. Spiller might be. He also seems like a faster, more elusive runner than the other post-Polian first round RBs.

The problem with post-Polian DBs has been that even when a first round pick was successful (a good player) it was still a failure (first-contract-and-out). Thus far, Nix has been very good at keeping the players worth keeping. This means that if Gilmore plays well, there's a chance he'll be retained for most or all his career.

If Spiller and Gilmore turn into success stories, they will do two things. 1) Strengthen the team at RB and DB, respectively. 2) Discourage the team from using first round picks on RBs and DBs, thereby freeing those picks up for use elsewhere.

[Meathead]

stopped reading at whitner: bust

Edited by Meathead, 25 May 2012 - 02:31 PM.

[uncle flap]

I don't want to take the time to do the research to see if the following is in fact true, but I have a theory.

Players at those positions cost more than most other positions to re-sign once the player hits the open market in the prime of their careers.

They also seemingly hit the wall at an earlier age than most other positions.

So, economically, it would seem to make sense to draft these players early to get the best prospects and try to get some good years out of them while the cost is low, and not breaking the bank to re-sign them when they don't have many years left, even if they are in their prime at the time.

My theory is that the Bills aren't the only team who have followed a model like that. I think the problem lies more in the production/talent of those players than the position they play(ed).

Just playing Devil's advocate here. Personally, I think you should plan on every guy you draft as being a Bill for life. I agree that Nix is operating on a long term plan and isn't just making knee-jerk reactions like his predecessors seemingly were doing. If you draft a guy who is panning out for you, lock him up early and avoid the FA bidding war. However, it takes two to tango. Maybe Winfield or Clements were approached with reasonable deals, but turned them down knowing there was a huge payday on the horizon.

I mentioned in another thread that unlike past regimes that have drafted to fill holes, Nix is being proactive. The example I used was that the Bills didn't pick Glenn because Bell left, they let Bell go because they planned on drafting an LT early.

[Adam]

Whitner was pretty good last year. Antowain Smith was a respectable part of a team that won the superbowl Lynch has played well for Seattle. Smith and Burris were very good. MaGahee was solid.

[jeremy2020]

This post lacks coherence and cohesion.

[Best Player Available]

jeremy2020, on 25 May 2012 - 02:47 PM, said:

This post lacks coherence and cohesion.

It's also filled with confusion.

[chris heff]

Best Player Available, on 25 May 2012 - 03:02 PM, said:

It's also filled with confusion.

And convoluted.

[Adam]

Best Player Available, on 25 May 2012 - 03:02 PM, said:

It's also filled with confusion.

And collusion.

[sllib olaffub]

I think it would be very easy to go back and look at how Buffalo missed on players they should have drafted, with the wisdom of knowing which players ended up worthy of the first round.  But, the premise of the post - that Buffalo has wasted far too many top picks on two positions is valid; I will go further and say that as far as I am concerned, if an NFL team doesn't have a franchise QB, they should do anything they have to do to secure the best one they can get.  That means, going back ten years, if Buffalo had to give up 2 or 3 first round picks to land Cam Newton, or Aaron Rodgers, or some great QB - then it would have been worth it, simply because without that QB there is little to build a team around.

But, if you have the QB, you can do a lot of building in F.A. and in rounds 2 and after.  Another point, and this is probably one of the two biggest issues causing Buffalo to be so bad these past years - they simply weren't that great at recognizing talent.  You've got to see and recognize which players are worth the moves.  Now, Buffalo seems pretty good at evaluating talent.  I think Nix is fixing this team proper, and I think if Fitz is not great this year, or if V.Y. doesn't turn it around big time, then Nix's next move is to get that Franchise QB.

Lastly, when it comes to the problem of the Bills - it was a certain cheapness in regard players.  That did influence their contracts and drafting, no doubt.  Not that they wouldn't spend money - it was more like, until just recently, they seemed to view their team as not quite good enough to really invest in.

[FeartheLosing]

Edwards, on 25 May 2012 - 01:58 PM, said:

Over the last 40 years, the Bills have used 25% of their first picks of the draft on RBs, and another 25% on DBs. The Bills' decision to use fully 50% of their first picks of the draft on RBs and DBs is one of the reasons why this team has traditionally had a losing record.

(Note that the concept of a first pick of the draft is not interchangeable with a first round pick. Jim Kelly, for example, was a first round pick. But he wasn't the Bills' first pick of the draft, because the Bills chose a TE two picks earlier.)

During the post-Polian/pre-Nix era, the Bills have used first picks of the draft on the following DBs:

• Thomas Smith. Result: seven years of decent play
• Jeff Burris. Result: left the team after four years. Had a ten year career.
• Antoine Winfield. Result: left the team after five years. Had a thirteen year career.
• Nate Clements. Result: left the team after six years. Has had an eleven year career thus far.
• Donte Whitner. Result: bust
• Leodis McKelvin. Result: bust

There are no success stories on the above list. Some of the DBs left early because they were busts, and some left early because the team decided to let them go first-contract-and-out. Either way, first round DBs didn't stay long. The Bills responded by using early picks on the replacements for those DBs.

In the post-Polian/pre-Nix era, the Bills have used first picks of the draft on the following RBs:

• Antowain Smith. Result: bust
• Willis McGahee. Result: disappointment
• Marshawn Lynch. Result: bust

The above list would be longer if it included Travis Henry (second round) and Spiller (a Nix pick). Also, Butler only used one first or second round pick on a RB, which means he used early picks on RBs at a much lower rate than TD or Marv. (Which is one of the things Butler did right.) Needless to say, there are no success stories on the above list.

I'm not suggesting that it's always a mistake for a team to use a first round pick on a RB or DB. If Antoine Winfield, for example, had been retained for the entirety of his career, he would have represented an excellent use of the Bills' first round pick. The reason Antoine Winfield didn't become a success story for the Bills was because of their strategy of allowing their best DBs to go first-contract-and-out.

During the post-Polian era, the Bills have had severe problems at QB and on the offensive line. They used three first round picks on the QB position: Rob Johnson, Drew Bledsoe, and JP Losman. One of those was a trade for another team's aging backup, and did not represent a real effort to find a long-term solution to the problem at QB. That means just two first round picks were used on attempts to find a long-term answer at quarterback, as opposed to nine on DBs + RBs. Similarly, only two first round picks were used on OTs during the post-Polian era, despite the fact the Bills' offensive line has typically been disappointing at best during that time.

Bill from NYC's opposition to using early picks on RBs or DBs is a rational response to the last 20 years of Bills' history. The number of early picks used on those positions has been excessive, and not once during the post-Polian/pre-Nix era has any first round DB or RB resulted in a success story. The team has had very severe problems elsewhere--especially at QB and on the OL--because too many picks were squandered on RBs and DBs.

But just because Nix has used first round picks on a RB and a DB, does not necessarily mean he's falling into the same trap as his predecessors. One of the reasons the post-Polian first round RBs were busts was because none of them were anything special at catching passes out of the backfield. Spiller might be. He also seems like a faster, more elusive runner than the other post-Polian first round RBs.

The problem with post-Polian DBs has been that even when a first round pick was successful (a good player) it was still a failure (first-contract-and-out). Thus far, Nix has been very good at keeping the players worth keeping. This means that if Gilmore plays well, there's a chance he'll be retained for most or all his career.

If Spiller and Gilmore turn into success stories, they will do two things. 1) Strengthen the team at RB and DB, respectively. 2) Discourage the team from using first round picks on RBs and DBs, thereby freeing those picks up for use elsewhere.

Not only Whitner being a starting safety his entire career, last year he  played on a 13-3 team that won up to the NFC championship game. NWIH is Whitner a bust!

Antoine Smith went to the Patriots after he left the Bills and he took them to a SB win as the starting RB.

Lynch took his new team to the playoffs last year. The Seahawks were happy as hell to get him for a measly 4th.

Aaron Maybin drafted with a first round pick specifically as a pass  rusher and the Bills couldn't get one sack outta him in his 2 years in  Buffalo. Gets picked up by the Jets and gets 6 sacks!

A bust is John McCargo, 1st round pick that didn't do a GD thing his entire career, and still hasn't!


I think this thread speaks more about the Bills coaches then it does about the GM, to me coaching is everything.


Nix screwed up big time in his first Bills draft and free agency period. From a #1 pick at RB that has been a back up for 2 years with a team desperate for starters at so many positions to Cornell Green at RT! Can we all stop comparing a GM that still hasn't had a winning season to a certain HoF GM. The Bills have had bad coaching, bad GM's, bad head of scouting since John Butler / AJ Smith left for SD, and so far Nix / Gailey have yet to prove that has changed.

It has more to do with an owner who didn't care if his team won or not during the decade 2000-2010 more then anything else.





Worst post I've ever read from ya EA

[Bill from NYC]

You guys can blast away at EA, but please, tell us why the Bills have a long term, established history of losing football games. Look, we all love this franchise. But while teams were drafting impact players, we were drafting Donte Whitner. Whitner, on the Bills, gave up touchdown passes to TE after TE, and was flattened by who? Sammy Morris.
Does this ring a bell?
A. Smth was a so-so running back on the Bills because we had no foundation. After Polian left, Levy gained power, and the Bills drafted a sick number of DBs. They played out their contracts and left. When he came back as GM, he tanked the 06 draft, which was stacked. Then he signed free agents who sucked. And let's not forget the hiring of Jauron, a proven incompetent loser.  
Levy is heralded by many, but imo he was a not so great coach who inherited lots of talent from Polian. As a GM, he was 100x worse.
I can barely stomach the Gilmore selection. It was a stupid pick imo, but at least we firmed up the defensive foundation via free agency.
EA, imo, is making tons of sense. There is little reason to believe, looking at Bills history, that picks such as Spiller and Gilmore were anything but stupid. It may work THIS time, but it never has.
Once again we can hope, but this is what we do.

GO BILLS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Beerball]

Adam, on 25 May 2012 - 03:50 PM, said:

And collusion.

Are you confounded?

[FeartheLosing]

sllib olaffub, on 25 May 2012 - 03:59 PM, said:

I think it would be very easy to go back and look at how Buffalo missed on players they should have drafted, with the wisdom of knowing which players ended up worthy of the first round.  But, the premise of the post - that Buffalo has wasted far too many top picks on two positions is valid; I will go further and say that as far as I am concerned, if an NFL team doesn't have a franchise QB, they should do anything they have to do to secure the best one they can get.  That means, going back ten years, if Buffalo had to give up 2 or 3 first round picks to land Cam Newton, or Aaron Rodgers, or some great QB - then it would have been worth it, simply because without that QB there is little to build a team around.

But, if you have the QB, you can do a lot of building in F.A. and in rounds 2 and after.  Another point, and this is probably one of the two biggest issues causing Buffalo to be so bad these past years - they simply weren't that great at recognizing talent.  You've got to see and recognize which players are worth the moves.  Now, Buffalo seems pretty good at evaluating talent.  I think Nix is fixing this team proper, and I think if Fitz is not great this year, or if V.Y. doesn't turn it around big time, then Nix's next move is to get that Franchise QB.

Lastly, when it comes to the problem of the Bills - it was a certain cheapness in regard players.  That did influence their contracts and drafting, no doubt.  Not that they wouldn't spend money - it was more like, until just recently, they seemed to view their team as not quite good enough to really invest in.

The Biggest problem of this franchise since John Butler / Bill Polian has been the lack of ability to even identify good talent at all, at almost any position.  I suppose a premise could be made that it was easier to identify the talent in RB's & DB's vs other positions. So perhaps that is why the team went that way so many times, or perhaps because this owner saw what OJ Simpson and Thurman Thomas did for his franchise he will always want to draft RB's with that #1 pick.

The Bills tried to draft their franchise QB when they traded back up into the first round for JP Losman.... it certainly didn't help to have so many coaching changes (bad coaches), scheme changes(bad schemes) during Losman's career in Buffalo.




Two things make me think the Bills might be finally moving in the right direction.

First, is the fact that the Bills (Buddy Nix stated such) would have selected Cam Newton if he had been available. This is significant  in the fact that they didn't think any other QB was worth that #3 overall in 2010. Plus the fact that they didn't go QB again this year tells me they must think enough of Fitz to not be pulling the trigger on drafting any QB. It also tells me that the Bills now have finally the ability to actually identify top QB talent when they see it.

Second, the fact that Buddy Nix was able to obtain Mario Williams at 100 mill shows me that the team finally wants to win again,  rather then just put butts in seats and make a profit. We still need to see if what the Bills have done this off season equates to wins

Bill from NYC, on 25 May 2012 - 05:12 PM, said:

You guys can blast away at EA, but please, tell us why the Bills have a long term, established history of losing football games. Look, we all love this franchise. But while teams were drafting impact players, we were drafting Donte Whitner. Whitner, on the Bills, gave up touchdown passes to TE after TE, and was flattened by who? Sammy Morris. youtube.com/watch?v=UAHWsKoSN7M
Does this ring a bell?
A. Smth was a so-so running back on the Bills because we had no foundation. After Polian left, Levy gained power, and the Bills drafted a sick number of DBs. They played out their contracts and left. When he came back as GM, he tanked the 06 draft, which was stacked. Then he signed free agents who sucked. And let's not forget the hiring of Jauron, a proven incompetent loser.  
Levy is heralded by many, but imo he was a not so great coach who inherited lots of talent from Polian. As a GM, he was 100x worse.
I can barely stomach the Gilmore selection. It was a stupid pick imo, but at least we firmed up the defensive foundation via free agency.
EA, imo, is making tons of sense. There is little reason to believe, looking at Bills history, that picks such as Spiller and Gilmore were anything but stupid. It may work THIS time, but it never has.
Once again we can hope, but this is what we do.

GO BILLS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Bill, you keep blasting guys like Donte Whitner because the Bills drafted him with a #1 pick when the rest of the NFL world had him graded as a 2nd or 3rd rounder. Was that his fault he was drafted so high and coached so badly in Buffalo? Like I said, Donte just started on a 13-3 team that lost in the playoffs to the team that won the SB.
Whitner is pretty far from a bust.  If anything the Bills have proven they don't know how to get production out of many many players.  Jaberi Greer with a NO Saints SB ring on his finger ring any bells?

Marv Levy didn't gain any power or draft any DB's!  However, the GM at that time John Butler did, Dick jauron did.  For all we know Jauron is still having nightmares of Tom Brady throwing deep to Randy Moss for TD after TD.

Marv Levy is a HoF HC who was asked by his old friend and onwer of the Buffalo Bills Ralph Wilson to come to Buffalo and be his GM. From what I've read Levy only returned because he thought he had a chance to become a head coach again.

I would suggest redirecting all that pent up hate of Marv Levy to the man who asked him to be the GM, the man who allowed Dick Jauron to be de facto GM for 2 years. The man who allowed his team to be run by people who should have never been in charge of a sock drawer much less a billion dollar org.

[Bill from NYC]

Fear the Beard, on 25 May 2012 - 06:06 PM, said:

The Biggest problem of this franchise since John Butler / Bill Polian has been the lack of ability to even identify good talent at all, at almost any position.  I suppose a premise could be made that it was easier to identify the talent in RB's & DB's vs other positions. So perhaps that is why the team went that way so many times, or perhaps because this owner saw what OJ Simpson and Thurman Thomas did for his franchise he will always want to draft RB's with that #1 pick.

The Bills tried to draft their franchise QB when they traded back up into the first round for JP Losman.... it certainly didn't help to have so many coaching changes (bad coaches), scheme changes(bad schemes) during Losman's career in Buffalo.




Two things make me think the Bills might be finally moving in the right direction.

First, is the fact that the Bills (Buddy Nix stated such) would have selected Cam Newton if he had been available. This is significant  in the fact that they didn't think any other QB was worth that #3 overall in 2010. Plus the fact that they didn't go QB again this year tells me they must think enough of Fitz to not be pulling the trigger on drafting any QB. It also tells me that the Bills now have finally the ability to actually identify top QB talent when they see it.

Second, the fact that Buddy Nix was able to obtain Mario Williams at 100 mill shows me that the team finally wants to win again,  rather then just put butts in seats and make a profit. We still need to see if what the Bills have done this off season equates to wins


Bill, you keep blasting guys like Donte Whitner because the Bills drafted him with a #1 pick when the rest of the NFL world had him graded as a 2nd or 3rd rounder. Was that his fault he was drafted so high and coached so badly in Buffalo? Like I said, Donte just started on a 13-3 team that lost in the playoffs to the team that won the SB.
Whitner is pretty far from a bust.  If anything the Bills have proven they don't know how to get production out of many many players.  Jaberi Greer with a NO Saints SB ring on his finger ring any bells?

Marv Levy didn't gain any power or draft any DB's!  However, the GM at that time John Butler did, Dick jauron did.  For all we know Jauron is still having nightmares of Tom Brady throwing deep to Randy Moss for TD after TD.

Marv Levy is a HoF HC who was asked by his old friend and onwer of the Buffalo Bills Ralph Wilson to come to Buffalo and be his GM. From what I've read Levy only returned because he thought he had a chance to become a head coach again.

I would suggest redirecting all that pent up hate of Marv Levy to the man who asked him to be the GM, the man who allowed Dick Jauron to be de facto GM for 2 years. The man who allowed his team to be run by people who should have never been in charge of a sock drawer much less a billion dollar org.

I don't "hate" Levy. I simply will not pour undeserved accolades upon him. If you choose to, be my guest.  
There is certainly more blame to go around wrt the failure of this franchise, starting with the owner. But do forgive me if I don't worship at the Levy altar.

[JohnC]

Bill from NYC, on 25 May 2012 - 05:12 PM, said:

I can barely stomach the Gilmore selection. It was a stupid pick imo, but at least we firmed up the defensive foundation via free agency.
EA, imo, is making tons of sense. There is little reason to believe, looking at Bills history, that picks such as Spiller and Gilmore were anything but stupid. It may work THIS time, but it never has.
Once again we can hope, but this is what we do.

GO BILLS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Gilmore was the second best CB in the best conference, SEC. He was a top 8-12 player taken with a top 10 pick. The Bills drafted a LT in the second round. Would you have problems if the Bills took an OT in the first round and then a CB in the second round? In tandem both were good picks. In addition the Gilmore pick made sense with the release of Drayton Florence and the durability isse with McGee.

You answered your own concerns about the first pick when you acknowledged that the defensive foundation was addressed via free agency. Given that, then why are you so irritated by the first round pick? I know you were enamored with Hightower, the LB from Bama, but Gilmore was rated higher by every draft analyst that I'm aware of.  

You have understandably often complained that the organization has a history of not knowing how to build a team. You constantly (smartly) make the point that it is critical to build the lines and then work outward to the skill positions. Stand back and take a look. Nix has done it with the bulking up of both lines. It may not be in the draft sequence you like but your concerns certainly have been addressed.

Edited by JohnC, 25 May 2012 - 07:20 PM.

[BillsFanM.D.]

jeremy2020, on 25 May 2012 - 02:47 PM, said:

This post lacks coherence and cohesion.

Best Player Available, on 25 May 2012 - 03:02 PM, said:

It's also filled with confusion.

chris heff, on 25 May 2012 - 03:27 PM, said:

And convoluted.

Adam, on 25 May 2012 - 03:50 PM, said:

And collusion.

Beerball, on 25 May 2012 - 05:22 PM, said:

Are you confounded?

the consternation is overwhelming.

[MDH]

Edwards, on 25 May 2012 - 01:58 PM, said:

The number of early picks used on those positions has been excessive, and not once during the post-Polian/pre-Nix era has any first round DB or RB resulted in a success story.

Yes, the number of picks at RB and DB have been excessive but to say there are no success stories simply isn't true.  

Winfield and Clements both performed at a 1st round level (and Burris and a few others on your list were solid.)  The failure with both had nothing to do with the drafting and everything to do with the re-signing.  Letting guys play out their rookie deals and walking has been a bigger problem than drafting from these positions and has contributed to the need to continuously re-draft from them.  When you hit on a 1st round pick you can't simply let them play their contracts out and let them sign elsewhere only to have to draft that position again.  That is a recipe for walking on a treadmill and never improving - which is exactly what the Bills have done.

[FeartheLosing]

Bill from NYC, on 25 May 2012 - 07:04 PM, said:

I don't "hate" Levy. I simply will not pour undeserved accolades upon him. If you choose to, be my guest.  
There is certainly more blame to go around wrt the failure of this franchise, starting with the owner. But do forgive me if I don't worship at the Levy altar.

I don't worship the man, but I do admire him for what he accomplished during his time with the Buffalo Bills.

Marv's claim to fame was that he was a special teams coach for George Allen's Rams and Redskins, Marv was never an OC or DC afaik. I can recall the Bills hiring him in 86 after they fired Bullough mid season.  I immediately read everything I could on the guy and saw that he tried to run the wing -T while as HC in KC I'm thinking oh. no!  They went from Kay Stephenson /  Hank Bullough with Jim Ringo as OC to another tool for HC.  But then I read that Marv coached the Chiefs for 5 season and they got better every year until the strike year. Then I also read that Levy won 2 grey cups with the Alouettes. He was also the head coach of the USFL Chicago Blitz for a season.

Marv was a great head coach as he hired some really good assistant coaches, and let them do their jobs without interfering. Marv was a supreme motivator, and over the course of his career with the Buffalo Bills had some amazing sayings that are now known as "Marvisms" He used to take a quote from the ballad of Sir Andrew Barton said it to his players.

"Fight on, my men," says Sir Andrew Barton,

"I am hurt, but I am not slain;

I'll lay me down and bleed a while,

And then I'll rise and fight again.


At the start of a game Marv would say.... "Where else would you rather be, then right here, right now!"

"Ability without character will lose. The Buffalo Bills are going to be a team of high character."


A reporter once asked Marv, At one time you hid your age, now you seem to celebrate it. What happened?

I came out of the closet on it, I guess. Way back when I was hired in  1986, I was 61 years of age, and it sounded too old so I lied and said I  was 58. Finally I cleared that up. Maybe as I matured I came to realize  it wasn't a factor. It's what you can do that counts.


"Norm Pollom (the former Bills chief college scout) is a good personnel  man and a good friend of mine. He said, "If we take this guy, he's going  to go to the Pro Bowl.' I said, Well, let's take somebody who's going  to take us to the Super Bowl. And we picked Shane Conlan."

"I'm old enough to know my limitations and I'm young enough to exceed them."

"If you don't change with the times, the times are going to change you."

"If you listen to the fans, you will end up being one."

"They say two things happen when you get older. One is you begin to  forget things . . . and I can't remember what the other one is right  now."

"don't be dumb, don't be dirty"

   "Great   football coaches have the vision to see,   the faith to believe, the courage to   do... and 25 great players."

  

   "Security   comes from earning it--not seeking it."

  

   "Systems   don't win, players do."   

  

      "Adversity is an opportunity for   heroism."

  

   "The   harder you work, the harder it is to   surrender."

  

   "What it   takes to win is simple, it's not easy."

  

   "Plan   your work and work your plan."

  

   "If you   have everything prepared, the rest will   take care of itself."

  

   "What you   do should speak so loudly that no one   will hear what you say."

  

   "Expect   rejection, but expect even more strongly   to overcome it."

  

   "There   will be many failures sprinkled among   the successes you enjoy."

  

   "A   failure becomes just one time at bat if   you refuse to let it defeat you."

No other head coach has done more for the Buffalo Bills then what Marv levy has done in his 11 year career with the Bills, nobody else is even close.JMO  Probably why RW asked an 81 year old Marv Levy to be his GM in 2006


Edit:  wanted to add one I had forgotten. "when its to tough for them, Its just right for us"

Edited by Fear the Beard, 29 May 2012 - 05:02 PM.

[Hopeful]

Edwards, on 25 May 2012 - 01:58 PM, said:

During the post-Polian/pre-Nix era, the Bills have used first picks of the draft on the following DBs:

• Thomas Smith. Result: seven years of decent play
• Jeff Burris. Result: left the team after four years. Had a ten year career.
• Antoine Winfield. Result: left the team after five years. Had a thirteen year career.
• Nate Clements. Result: left the team after six years. Has had an eleven year career thus far.
• Donte Whitner. Result: bust
• Leodis McKelvin. Result: bust

In the post-Polian/pre-Nix era, the Bills have used first picks of the draft on the following RBs:

• Antowain Smith. Result: bust
• Willis McGahee. Result: disappointment
• Marshawn Lynch. Result: bust

You have an interesting argument regarding the Bills draft choices - certainly it's inarguable that letting a starter who was drafted high leave after one contract only to draft his replacement, is not the path to success.

We weren't happy with Whitner's play, yet he started for us, and went to the pro-bowl with the '9ers this year which seems to matter a lot to some folks.  Is that really a typical definition of "bust"?
Likewise, Lynch didn't seem willing to give B'lo his best effort, yet using the word "bust" does not seem quite appropriate to describe the 1200 yds and 12 TDs he had for Seattle in 2011.  He got a pretty juicy contract for a "bust".

To me a "bust" is someone who never sees the field, or who plays abominably when he does.  McCargo is more my idea of a bust - drafted in the 1st round, on the team 5 years, started one (1) game.
Maybin was well on his way to Bust-hood - drafted 11th overall in the first round, played three years, started one (1) game - if he continues to have success as a situational pass rusher for the Jets, is "bust" the right word even there?

[MARCELL DAREUS POWER]

to be fair, outside of the 2000 draft, butler was a fantasitc gm.  he was the major reason we had good success in 98-00.

his 93-99 drafts were really good.

ironically nix was the lead scout during this time....

Edited by MARCELL DAREUS POWER, 26 May 2012 - 04:06 PM.