19 replies to this topic

[You herd it hear last]

Are defensive pass interference yards figured into any of the rating systems currently being used to 'rank' QB's? Or for that matter, WR's and DB's.

It seems like this penalty, and the yards associated with it, is one of THE most game-changing plays. But the stat doesn't seem to get it's say in any football conversation.

[Rubes]

I think that's a good point. Not sure it should count for a QB necessarily, but I agree that it's a huge penalty that can dramatically change the course of a game (see Bills-Pats last year).

I still wonder why the NFL hasn't gone to the college style, 15-yard penalty rather than the spot foul. It's almost as though pass interference has become part of the offensive strategy, as in, "Let's throw it deep in the hopes that we either catch it or get the PI call."

I don't really like that it has become that.

[DrDareustein]

Rubes, on 08 December 2012 - 10:36 AM, said:

I think that's a good point. Not sure it should count for a QB necessarily, but I agree that it's a huge penalty that can dramatically change the course of a game (see Bills-Pats last year).

I still wonder why the NFL hasn't gone to the college style, 15-yard penalty rather than the spot foul. It's almost as though pass interference has become part of the offensive strategy, as in, "Let's throw it deep in the hopes that we either catch it or get the PI call."

I don't really like that it has become that.

Agreed, but it's a lose/lose situation. If they make it a 15-yard penalty, then it becomes a Defensive strategy that "once a WR goes past 15 yards, tackle him if he gets open".

[metzelaars_lives]

Rubes, on 08 December 2012 - 10:36 AM, said:

I think that's a good point. Not sure it should count for a QB necessarily, but I agree that it's a huge penalty that can dramatically change the course of a game (see Bills-Pats last year).

I still wonder why the NFL hasn't gone to the college style, 15-yard penalty rather than the spot foul. It's almost as though pass interference has become part of the offensive strategy, as in, "Let's throw it deep in the hopes that we either catch it or get the PI call."

I don't really like that it has become that.

Or how bout Bills-Pats this year for that matter?  Agreed 100%  I've been saying this for years, but I feel like it's finally come to a head.  In basketball when you're fouled in the act of shooting, you get two shots.  They don't just hand you two points.  If you get a pass interference penalty 25 yards down field- however questionable the call- they hand you the ball there so it's as good as an actual catch.  The punishment does not fit the crime.  I am so freaking sick of rinky dink PI calls all the way down the field that cost defenses huge chunks of yards and more than anything, offenses getting the ball handed to them at the 1.  There should be two calls- an egregious, spot foul PI- like the guy would've made the catch easily- or a 10-15 yard penalty one (which would get called 80-90% of the time).

Edited by metzelaars_lives, 08 December 2012 - 11:09 AM.

[Mr. WEO]

DrDareustein, on 08 December 2012 - 10:39 AM, said:

Agreed, but it's a lose/lose situation. If they make it a 15-yard penalty, then it becomes a Defensive strategy that "once a WR goes past 15 yards, tackle him if he gets open".

Don't see this happening in college...

[Matt in KC]

DrDareustein, on 08 December 2012 - 10:39 AM, said:

Agreed, but it's a lose/lose situation. If they make it a 15-yard penalty, then it becomes a Defensive strategy that "once a WR goes past 15 yards, tackle him if he gets open".

I see your point, but if a defender is close enough to tackle him, shouldn't he just try to defend him?  Are there really a lot of players that are blowing past DBs 15 yards downfield?

The only place I don't like the 15 yard rule is 3rd or 4th and more than 15 when it is a viable defense to flagrantly interfere rather than get beat.

[metzelaars_lives]

Matt in KC, on 08 December 2012 - 11:20 AM, said:

I see your point, but if a defender is close enough to tackle him, shouldn't he just try to defend him?  Are there really a lot of players that are blowing past DBs 15 yards downfield?

The only place I don't like the 15 yard rule is 3rd or 4th and more than 15 when it is a viable defense to flagrantly interfere rather than get beat.

So then you make it an automatic first down like virtually every other defensive penalty.  Is that not the case in college?  I don't watch enough CFB.

[DrDareustein]

Matt in KC, on 08 December 2012 - 11:20 AM, said:

I see your point, but if a defender is close enough to tackle him, shouldn't he just try to defend him?  Are there really a lot of players that are blowing past DBs 15 yards downfield?

The only place I don't like the 15 yard rule is 3rd or 4th and more than 15 when it is a viable defense to flagrantly interfere rather than get beat.

Sure thing, I just meant to show that both ways could be abused if the players/coaches really want to. We dont see it much in college, but there is also a lot more integrity in the college game than in the pros.

[Matt in KC]

I don't disagree the PI calls are huge and often "too much".  Even wide open, catching a pass running full speed downfield is no gimme.  15 yards and/or a first down are as generous as any defensive penalty should be IMO.

I liked the idea someone had that with the current defensive penalties that offensive PI should move the O back as much (OPI 28 yards downfield = move the O back 28).

[RJ (not THAT RJ)]

Matt in KC, on 08 December 2012 - 11:20 AM, said:

I see your point, but if a defender is close enough to tackle him, shouldn't he just try to defend him?  Are there really a lot of players that are blowing past DBs 15 yards downfield?

The only place I don't like the 15 yard rule is 3rd or 4th and more than 15 when it is a viable defense to flagrantly interfere rather than get beat.

In college it is automatic first down. Which is also true of PI in the NFL even if it happens short of the marker.

[You herd it hear last]

RJ (not THAT RJ), on 08 December 2012 - 11:58 AM, said:

In college it is automatic first down. Which is also true of PI in the NFL even if it happens short of the marker.

I was thinking it'd be a little bit better with:the ball being placed at the spot of the foul and the repeat down-and-distance, so at least they have another possible strategic obstacle on the next play. It may also encourage the long pass earlier in the series.

[DrDareustein]

madtowntobuffalo, on 08 December 2012 - 12:15 PM, said:

I was thinking it'd be a little bit better with:the ball being placed at the spot of the foul and the repeat down-and-distance, so at least they have another possible strategic obstacle on the next play. It may also encourage the long pass earlier in the series.

This is an interesting idea...

[Charles Romes]

I would like them to go back to the night train lane days where the db was allowed to tackle the receiver with the qb backing up to throw.  Since that's not going happen there should be a two tier level of severity system in place for pass interference penalties,  as in running into the kicker and roughing the kicker.

[metzelaars_lives]

Charles Romes, on 08 December 2012 - 02:20 PM, said:

I would like them to go back to the night train lane days where the db was allowed to tackle the receiver with the qb backing up to throw.  Since that's not going happen there should be a two tier level of severity system in place for pass interference penalties,  as in running into the kicker and roughing the kicker.

Yes, that's exactly what I said.  This will happen sooner than later.  It's gotten out of control this year.

[NoSaint]

Charles Romes, on 08 December 2012 - 02:20 PM, said:

I would like them to go back to the night train lane days where the db was allowed to tackle the receiver with the qb backing up to throw.  Since that's not going happen there should be a two tier level of severity system in place for pass interference penalties,  as in running into the kicker and roughing the kicker.

I can only imagine the complaints about officials with that....

[Alphadawg7]

Rubes, on 08 December 2012 - 10:36 AM, said:

I think that's a good point. Not sure it should count for a QB necessarily, but I agree that it's a huge penalty that can dramatically change the course of a game (see Bills-Pats last year).

I still wonder why the NFL hasn't gone to the college style, 15-yard penalty rather than the spot foul. It's almost as though pass interference has become part of the offensive strategy, as in, "Let's throw it deep in the hopes that we either catch it or get the PI call."

I don't really like that it has become that.

While I agree with you, the main reason this hasnt happened is the fear that the 15 yards isnt significant enough to discourage a guy tackling a WR to prevent a TD.  Lets say the Bills are on the 50 and throw a pass to near the endzone to a guy who has position or has beat the DB.  If the DB doesnt interfere its likely a TD...if he does interfere, its still likely a TD because it will be first an goal from inside the 5 or on the 1.  If you change the rule to only being 15 yards, then the DB has plenty of incentive to just tackle the guy and prevent the TD because the O would only gain 15 yards and would still be 35 yards out.  

That has always been the reason to my understanding of why the rule is the way it is.  However, I do agree that PI has become to much of a game changer, especially in all the pass favorable rules.

[ganesh]

metzelaars_lives, on 08 December 2012 - 11:07 AM, said:

Or how bout Bills-Pats this year for that matter?  Agreed 100%  I've been saying this for years, but I feel like it's finally come to a head.  In basketball when you're fouled in the act of shooting, you get two shots.  They don't just hand you two points.  If you get a pass interference penalty 25 yards down field- however questionable the call- they hand you the ball there so it's as good as an actual catch.  The punishment does not fit the crime.  I am so freaking sick of rinky dink PI calls all the way down the field that cost defenses huge chunks of yards and more than anything, offenses getting the ball handed to them at the 1.  There should be two calls- an egregious, spot foul PI- like the guy would've made the catch easily- or a 10-15 yard penalty one (which would get called 80-90% of the time).

Disagree....The basketball analogy is incorrect. When you foul, the opponent does not start from their own end...They get to score 2 baskets without anyone blocking them....In NBA that is close to 80% success..

[CSBill]

ganesh, on 09 December 2012 - 06:40 AM, said:

Disagree....The basketball analogy is incorrect. When you foul, the opponent does not start from their own end...They get to score 2 baskets without anyone blocking them....In NBA that is close to 80% success..

Unless you're Dwight Howard.

[Nanker]

ganesh, on 09 December 2012 - 06:40 AM, said:

Disagree....The basketball analogy is incorrect. When you foul, the opponent does not start from their own end...They get to score 2 baskets without anyone blocking them....In NBA that is close to 80% success..

Not when Wilt Chamberlain or Shaquille O'Neal were at the line.

[ganesh]

Nanker, on 09 December 2012 - 07:24 AM, said:

Not when Wilt Chamberlain or Shaquille O'Neal were at the line.

There are always exceptions to things