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Thoughts on our Receivers


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#1 Rob's House

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 01:41 AM

Supposing we added a true #1 receiver to work the outside with Stevie working out of the slot in 3+ receiver sets and moving to the outside in 2 reciever sets, what role would the rest of the receivers assume, and who could be the second wide out in the 3+ receiver sets?

The idea here is to construct a dynamic passing attacks the whole field: one that stretches the field, creates mismatches underneath, and leaves Spiller open to be the kind of receiving threat Marshall Faulk was for the Rams.

Donald Jones - He's been a good but not great all around receiver thus far, with decent size, speed, and hands. Could he be the other wide out in the three receiver set or is he just a depth guy?

TJ Graham - There's no questioning the kid's speed, and when he gets the ball with blockers he often looks like a natural RB, but can he develop the all around game to make defenses fear him? In other words, does he have what it takes to be a starter, or is he a one (or maybe 2) trick pony?

Brad Smith - Hasn't really been used as a primary receiver, but why not? He's big, strong, fast, and made several clutch catches to sustain drives throughout the season. If he focused on learning the position could be become a viable option as a receiver? And if so would he fit well on the outside? If not is he a viable option for the other slot in 4 receiver sets?

David Nelson - Another good possession receiver w/o much speed, the outside clearly isn't his strong suit. Does he have what it takes to be the guy that gets the clutch 3rd downs and makes the defense pay for showing too much respect to the other threats?

#2 reddogblitz

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 01:48 AM

I'm hoping SJ and Nelson are the only WRs on this years roster next year.  We definitely need the tall fast go up in a crowd and come down with the football kind of guy.  After that I'd hope we can get guys who can catch the friggin' football.

Sean Peyton, Doug's old boss, says he like guys who can catch the football.  If you can't, he'll get rid of you and get someone who can.  I hope Doug takes this approach as well.  If he does, Donald Jones and Graham would be gone and better guys will be here.

As I see it we need to sign 2 quality FA WRs or draft 1 and sign 1.  The WR position needs a serious upgrade if we want to win.

And yes, I can say that even though we had Fitz throwing them the football last year.

#3 Rob's House

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 02:14 AM

View Postreddogblitz, on 18 January 2013 - 01:48 AM, said:

I'm hoping SJ and Nelson are the only WRs on this years roster next year.  We definitely need the tall fast go up in a crowd and come down with the football kind of guy.  After that I'd hope we can get guys who can catch the friggin' football.

Sean Peyton, Doug's old boss, says he like guys who can catch the football.  If you can't, he'll get rid of you and get someone who can.  I hope Doug takes this approach as well.  If he does, Donald Jones and Graham would be gone and better guys will be here.

As I see it we need to sign 2 quality FA WRs or draft 1 and sign 1.  The WR position needs a serious upgrade if we want to win.

And yes, I can say that even though we had Fitz throwing them the football last year.
Was Graham really that bad? I remember him dropping a couple of passes, but not to the extent that it really jumped out at me, of course I missed significant portions of several games. I do remember him blowing the route that could have won the NE game :wallbash: Do you think he could improve with experience or has value at least as a situational deep threat?

Edited by Rob's House, 18 January 2013 - 02:14 AM.


#4 Wagon Circler

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 02:29 AM

Too early to give up on Graham. Give him another year.
You can't teach speed.
This position definitely needs a veteran free agent upgrade.

#5 reddogblitz

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 02:34 AM

View PostRob, on 18 January 2013 - 02:14 AM, said:

Was Graham really that bad? I remember him dropping a couple of passes, but not to the extent that it really jumped out at me, of course I missed significant portions of several games. I do remember him blowing the route that could have won the NE game :wallbash: Do you think he could improve with experience or has value at least as a situational deep threat?
I'm not sure which game it was but, but in one of them he dropped 4 passes.  I also saw him drop about 5 or 6 others.  Sure he's fast, but if he can't catch, what good is he?  I hear he's fast but I never saw him get much separation if any on the long passes.  We need guys who can catch the football.  I'm tired of these guys dropping passes.

#6 Buffalo Barbarian

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 03:57 AM

View PostRob, on 18 January 2013 - 01:41 AM, said:

Supposing we added a true #1 receiver to work the outside with Stevie working out of the slot in 3+ receiver sets and moving to the outside in 2 reciever sets, what role would the rest of the receivers assume, and who could be the second wide out in the 3+ receiver sets?

The idea here is to construct a dynamic passing attacks the whole field: one that stretches the field, creates mismatches underneath, and leaves Spiller open to be the kind of receiving threat Marshall Faulk was for the Rams.

Donald Jones - He's been a good but not great all around receiver thus far, with decent size, speed, and hands. Could he be the other wide out in the three receiver set or is he just a depth guy?

TJ Graham - There's no questioning the kid's speed, and when he gets the ball with blockers he often looks like a natural RB, but can he develop the all around game to make defenses fear him? In other words, does he have what it takes to be a starter, or is he a one (or maybe 2) trick pony?

Brad Smith - Hasn't really been used as a primary receiver, but why not? He's big, strong, fast, and made several clutch catches to sustain drives throughout the season. If he focused on learning the position could be become a viable option as a receiver? And if so would he fit well on the outside? If not is he a viable option for the other slot in 4 receiver sets?

David Nelson - Another good possession receiver w/o much speed, the outside clearly isn't his strong suit. Does he have what it takes to be the guy that gets the clutch 3rd downs and makes the defense pay for showing too much respect to the other threats?

I think our WRs need to be vastly upgraded as we don't have a true number one. I want FAs Bowe and Welker.

#7 BuffaloBillsMagic1

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 06:41 AM

View PostBuffalo Barbarian, on 18 January 2013 - 03:57 AM, said:

I think our WRs need to be vastly upgraded as we don't have a true number one. I want FAs Bowe and Welker.
Woul dbe instant boost withthese two to Marone's offense. They would be ideal guys for it.  That and maybe draft Lemon in 5th or 6th round as he was pefect at SU.

#8 Kkspike

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 07:25 AM

Tj bad game was Seattle.as far as Bowe he makes his catches in the fourth quarter when they are down by  thirty- five.

#9 dbflaBill

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 08:05 AM

Top three WR I would like to see on this team are Nelson, stevie, and I believe Danario Alexander is a FA. The Bills brought him in for a tryout before SD signed him. He had a great yr with a qb that played as bad as fitz. He wouldnt cost a fortune and i believe hes 6'6". Hes young with a huge upside.

#10 marauderswr80

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 08:20 AM

Average

#11 ganesh

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 08:45 AM

View PostBuffalo Barbarian, on 18 January 2013 - 03:57 AM, said:

I think our WRs need to be vastly upgraded as we don't have a true number one. I want FAs Bowe and Welker.
+1. However I don't think we will spend another 8-10M at the WR position, especially when we don't have a QB.  The only incumbent WRs that we should take to camp should be SJ, Nelson and Graham.

#12 VirginiaMike

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 09:00 AM

Johnson, Nelson, & Graham stay -- find replacements for the others.  Jones brings good blocking to the table, but that's no enough to offset his mundane receiving skills.  Graham is a wild card -- there is not enough information to kow if he will work out, but he's worth another year.  Most wideouts take 2 or 3 years to really learn what it takes to be an NFL wideout.
A better QB would make any of our wideouts better -- but that it no secret.  :doh:

#13 mountainwampus

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 09:02 AM

View PostWagon Circler, on 18 January 2013 - 02:29 AM, said:

Too early to give up on Graham. Give him another year.
You can't teach speed.
This position definitely needs a veteran free agent upgrade.

Graham has good track speed, but he's a huge disappointment as a football player. Not sure if any other WR in the NFL has worse hands. He's not physical. Lacks any playmaking ability. His talent was projecting him as a 6th-undrafted. Doesn't matter that Nix thought highly of him. Nix is a complete moron and has no right keeping his job. Neither does Graham. Also, Donald Jones is also not a talented WR. He's dropped too many perfect passes that were would-be huge gains/TDs. He can catch a ball that he's facing but has he ever caught a ball over his shoulder? All I remember are drops. Graham and Jones are complete garbage.

#14 Fixxxer

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 09:10 AM

We need to upgrade our WRs, get a good QB. I'm not saying we couldn't upgrade and move SJ around and use him like NE uses Welker but I believe our WR unit is very underrated.
If we get a rookie QB and Marrone starts him early, we definately need another TE, they're rookies best friends.

#15 Gugny

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 09:13 AM

View PostRob, on 18 January 2013 - 01:41 AM, said:

Supposing we added a true #1 receiver to work the outside with Stevie working out of the slot in 3+ receiver sets and moving to the outside in 2 reciever sets, what role would the rest of the receivers assume, and who could be the second wide out in the 3+ receiver sets?

The idea here is to construct a dynamic passing attacks the whole field: one that stretches the field, creates mismatches underneath, and leaves Spiller open to be the kind of receiving threat Marshall Faulk was for the Rams.

Donald Jones - He's been a good but not great all around receiver thus far, with decent size, speed, and hands. Could he be the other wide out in the three receiver set or is he just a depth guy?

TJ Graham - There's no questioning the kid's speed, and when he gets the ball with blockers he often looks like a natural RB, but can he develop the all around game to make defenses fear him? In other words, does he have what it takes to be a starter, or is he a one (or maybe 2) trick pony?

Brad Smith - Hasn't really been used as a primary receiver, but why not? He's big, strong, fast, and made several clutch catches to sustain drives throughout the season. If he focused on learning the position could be become a viable option as a receiver? And if so would he fit well on the outside? If not is he a viable option for the other slot in 4 receiver sets?

David Nelson - Another good possession receiver w/o much speed, the outside clearly isn't his strong suit. Does he have what it takes to be the guy that gets the clutch 3rd downs and makes the defense pay for showing too much respect to the other threats?

I'm glad to see two things in your post, Rob:

1.  It is way too early to call TJ Graham a bust.  It seems to be the popular opinion here on TBD.  As you mentioned, he has great speed.  He was a rookie.  A rookie who was being asked to get open and catch passes when he had an empty backfield with an innaccurate QB throwing him the football.  Predictability + inaccuracy = really tough place to be a rookie wide receiver.  I think the kid is gonna be good.

2.  Brad Smith has done VERY well as a WR.  Whenever he lines up, he's a threat.  And he doesn't miss the passes that are actually catchable.  I like using him sparingly, though.  Not sure if he's an every down kinda guy.

Overall, I agree with your assessment, for the most part.  90% still believes that SJ is a true #1 WR.  The guy has been able to have three consecutive great seasons with Ryan Fitzpatrick as his QB.  That says a lot.

I am perfectly comfortable going in to next season with the current WR corps.  If the deal/pick was right and we're able to upgrade without sacrificing picking up players in positions of greater need ... hell yeah.  Go for it.

But I'd rather fix our LB problems and get some depth on the lines before going nuts upgrading a group of WRs that I think can do great things with a better QB and better play caller.

Go Bills.

#16 Matt in KC

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 09:19 AM

It's too early to get rid of Graham IMO.  WR is a hard position to get up to speed at in the NFL.  His drops were very noticeable in the Seattle game, but who knows what was happening (e.g. did he dislocate a finger that week?).

Unless he has a total melt down, I'd like to see the Bills stick with him at least 3 years.  He looked better to start the season than I expected from a rookie.  Let's see if he gets even stronger this offseason.

Brad Smith is one of our few playmakers.  Unfortunately he seems inconsistent to me.  He's a great emergency WR if we have him on the roster for other reasons.  While he flashes big plays, I don't think he's a great WR.

I think Nelson is a keeper, a clutch player that is go-to on 3rd down.  I'd rather have him in the slot than Stevie, but would like an offense were we move players around to stress/test the defense.

I'm confused on Donald Jones, who seems to run hot and cold.  In 2011 I was not very impressed toward the end, but then last year he came in and performed much better than I was expecting.  He definitely deserves to compete for a spot.  My best guess is that he's good enough when healthy, but not very good at playing through the minor injuries that are going to come up each year.

#17 BuffBill

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 09:21 AM

View PostWagon Circler, on 18 January 2013 - 02:29 AM, said:

Too early to give up on Graham. Give him another year.
You can't teach speed.
This position definitely needs a veteran free agent upgrade.
I agree, too early to give up on him, if we get a QB that can get him the ball downfield he might turn into something.  The WR position needs at least one veteran, badly, just as it did last year, of which Buddy gave up on once Vincent Jackson signed in Tampa.

#18 chris heff

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 09:31 AM

View PostVirginiaMike, on 18 January 2013 - 09:00 AM, said:

Johnson, Nelson, & Graham stay -- find replacements for the others.  Jones brings good blocking to the table, but that's no enough to offset his mundane receiving skills.  Graham is a wild card -- there is not enough information to kow if he will work out, but he's worth another year.  Most wideouts take 2 or 3 years to really learn what it takes to be an NFL wideout.
A better QB would make any of our wideouts better -- but that it no secret.  :doh:
You got it.

#19 thebandit27

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 09:41 AM

The best way to upgrade our WRs is to get a good QB.

QB makes the WRs, not the other way around.

View PostBuffalo Barbarian, on 18 January 2013 - 03:57 AM, said:

I think our WRs need to be vastly upgraded as we don't have a true number one. I want FAs Bowe and Welker.

Really?  This garbage again?  3 straight 1,000 yard seasons catching passes from Fitz, and people still spew this filth.

Go watch what Stevie has done against players like Revis and Richard Sherman...he's literally always open.  If he played for New England he'd be good for 90 catches and 1,400 yds per season.

#20 mattsox

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 09:56 AM

View PostBuffalo Barbarian, on 18 January 2013 - 03:57 AM, said:

I think our WRs need to be vastly upgraded as we don't have a true number one. I want FAs Bowe and Welker.

Agreed.  We need a #1 Guy here big time!!!