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Why does everyone think Matt Ryan is a top 6 QB?


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#1 FireChan

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 12:28 PM

I don't get it one bit.  All I hear is Brees, Rodgers, Mannings, Brady as the big 5 with Flacco, Matt Ryan and others close behind.  Matt Ryan is barely top 10, probably number 10.  It just baffles me, Matty Ice, a clutch player with 1 playoff win under his belt.  I just don't see it.

Obviously, some of you are not going to think he is, this is directed towards the others who do.  And please, don't muddle up the topic with "I'd take him over RF" and then 6 others guys give you a thumbs up post, it's off-topic and you know I can't resist a good RF debate, so we'll get derailed in 10 minutes.

#2 TheMadCap

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 12:42 PM

I think he has the top in one catagory: WORST. NICKNAME. EVER!

#3 Bronc24

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 12:44 PM

View PostFireChan, on 27 February 2013 - 12:28 PM, said:

I don't get it one bit.  All I hear is Brees, Rodgers, Mannings, Brady as the big 5 with Flacco, Matt Ryan and others close behind.  Matt Ryan is barely top 10, probably number 10.  It just baffles me, Matty Ice, a clutch player with 1 playoff win under his belt.  I just don't see it.

Obviously, some of you are not going to think he is, this is directed towards the others who do.  And please, don't muddle up the topic with "I'd take him over RF" and then 6 others guys give you a thumbs up post, it's off-topic and you know I can't resist a good RF debate, so we'll get derailed in 10 minutes.

Before entering into this debate (and you know I will), I'd be interested to see your top 10.

#4 Ed_Formerly_of_Roch

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 12:48 PM

I'm not a big fan of Ryan, meaning haven't seen a whole lot of him.  But based on what I've seen this would be my response to you.

He's been in the league what 4 or 5 years, team has won more games than any time I can recall.  Is it his fault that they gave up was it 24 second half points to lose the game?   I don't see what he's done to be faulted at other than yes winning playoff games.  But you also have to build the team around him, are they truely there yet?  Excuding the top five QB's you mention, do you feel they would have one more play off games with someone else at QB?  OK I won't say "I'd take him over RF" How about instead I'll say would the Falcons have one more games with RF, or insert any other name you'd like other than Manning, Rodgers, Brees, Brady and maybe another name or two that I'm forgetting.

Last but certainly not least, how many playoff wins did Jim Kelly have before 1991?  All I recall was them winning one wild card game per year, then losing.  And Kelly was out of college about eight seasons by then.

I wouldn't argue strongly that he absolutely is top 5 but do think he's closer to 5 than 10

Edited by Ed_Roch, 27 February 2013 - 12:59 PM.


#5 JM57

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 12:56 PM

View PostMarauder24, on 27 February 2013 - 12:44 PM, said:

Before entering into this debate (and you know I will), I'd be interested to see your top 10.

Yes please. If you're going to start a thread and make your stand that he's "barely top 10" you had better bring your top 10 list along with you. I'll start.

Brady, P. Manning, Rodgers, Brees, E. Manning, Big Ben, Flacco, Ryan, Schaub, Cutler (with the last two likely to be supplanted by RG3, Wilson, and/or Luck with their continued success)

#6 FireChan

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 12:58 PM

View PostMarauder24, on 27 February 2013 - 12:44 PM, said:

Before entering into this debate (and you know I will), I'd be interested to see your top 10.

View PostJM57, on 27 February 2013 - 12:56 PM, said:

Yes please. If you're going to start a thread and make your stand that he's "barely top 10" you had better bring your top 10 list along with you. I'll start.

Brady, P. Manning, Rodgers, Brees, E. Manning, Big Ben, Flacco, Ryan, Schaub, Cutler (with the last two likely to be supplanted by RG3, Wilson, and/or Luck with their continued success)

Do we want top ten last year or top ten overall in the league now?

Last season, 1 year of play, including post-season. (Ben not included because of injury)

Rodgers, Peyton, Brady, Brees,(interchangeably, not looking up the stats) Flacco, Wilson, RG3/Newton, Luck/Kaepernick, Ryan/Cutler

In the league, (Rookies and Kaepernick not in this list, too early.)

Rodgers, Peyton, Brady, Brees, Eli(interchangeably, not looking up the stats) Big Ben, Flacco, Newton, Rivers, Cutler/Ryan.

Don't expect to see RF at number 8, Marauder, although I'm sure you're half expecting it.

Edited by FireChan, 27 February 2013 - 01:08 PM.


#7 Ed_Formerly_of_Roch

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 01:00 PM

And you could get a lot of debate that Ryan belongs above Eli and Big Ben purely based on abilities.

View PostJM57, on 27 February 2013 - 12:56 PM, said:

Yes please. If you're going to start a thread and make your stand that he's "barely top 10" you had better bring your top 10 list along with you. I'll start.

Brady, P. Manning, Rodgers, Brees, E. Manning, Big Ben, Flacco, Ryan, Schaub, Cutler (with the last two likely to be supplanted by RG3, Wilson, and/or Luck with their continued success)


#8 atlbillsfan1975

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 01:05 PM

Before Matt Ryan the Falcons NEVER had back to back winning seasons,let alonemaking the playoffs in consecutive years.
They have completely changed the culture of the franchise. I live in Atlanta and watch most Falcons games one way or the other.
The Falcons have built the team around Ryan for a good reason, the guy can win.
He has 16 fourth quarter/OT come back wins and 23 game winning drives in his career SO FAR.
The playoff win drought ended this year. They were 15 yds away from going to the Super Bowl against a team that many said they had no shot against.
The problem with the Falcons is the D. Dimitrof is a disciple of Belichick. Find a great QB, give him weapons on O. They realize what the NFL is- a qb league.
If you do not think Ryan is in the top 7-8 guys, tell me who you would take over him? And explain why.
Ryan carried that team this year. M. Turner fell off big time from his 2010 performance and has been on a sharp decline. The Falcons run game is so bad they have to usually pass for it on third and short. Like the Pats do many times.
With out Ryan on the Falcons they are a 4-6 win team.

#9 Maddog69

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 01:09 PM

He was top 5 in QB rating, passing yards and passing TDs this year.  And he was tied with Peyton for 1st in completion percentage, for whatever that's worth.
I don't know if he is 4th, 5th, 6th, 8th or 10th best in the league.   I don't really care.   I know that he is a fanatastic QB and I would piss my pants if the Bills were able to find one as good as him.

#10 kobe808lak

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 01:12 PM

It is in no way a reach to put him in any top 6 QB list..

Rogers, Peyton, Brady, Brees, Big Ben, Matt Ryan, Flacco/Eli...

You are for some reason completely ignoring his regular season success, which has been amazing.... and he won a Playoff game this year and almost made it to the Big game.

Who the hell are you putting ahead of him if you say he is barely top 10???

#11 KOKBILLS

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 01:16 PM

Matt Ryan is a Top 10 NFL QB for sure...He's probably just behind Rodgers, Brees, Brady, and P Manning...

Top 10? Here's mine for 2013...

Rodgers, Brees, Brady, P Manning, Ryan, RGII, E Manning, Flacco, Luck, and Kaepernick (just barely overBig Ben, Cam Newton, and Russell Wilson)...

That was actually tougher than I thought it would be...The influx of young, talented QB's is very evident...Here they come! B-)

#12 FireChan

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 01:17 PM

View Postkobe808lak, on 27 February 2013 - 01:12 PM, said:

It is in no way a reach to put him in any top 6 QB list..

Rogers, Peyton, Brady, Brees, Big Ben, Matt Ryan, Flacco/Eli...

You are for some reason completely ignoring his regular season success, which has been amazing.... and he won a Playoff game this year and almost made it to the Big game.

Who the hell are you putting ahead of him if you say he is barely top 10???

I'm actually not ignoring it.  I just think he's a regular season hero, who can never get it done in the playoffs.  Hell, the only reason the team he beat for his only playoff win was even in the game was because of his turnovers.  If Pete Carrol didn't call that time out, another Falcons playoff loss would've been all his fault.

Flacco also wins in the playoffs. Consistently.  How anyone can put Ryan over Flacco now, especially after this year, is ridiculous.

Edited by FireChan, 27 February 2013 - 01:19 PM.


#13 Billsrhody

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 01:19 PM

You really have to give us your top 10 list if you're trying to make this argument. The truth is, Ryan is certainly in the top 10 and you can make the case that he's been playing better than Eli or Big Ben, which would only put him behind Rodgers, Brady, Manning, Brees and Flacco right now.

Edited by Billsrhody, 27 February 2013 - 01:20 PM.


#14 Maddog69

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 01:19 PM

OK.  I guess I just don't see the point of debating a specific "rank' on Matt Ryan.   Rankings are quite subjective.  Stats tell me that he was definitely a top 5 QB this year.  Where somebody ranks him is meaningless to me.   I will exit the thread and leave you guys to it.  And by the way, he is definitely better than RF.

#15 Billsrhody

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 01:20 PM

View PostFireChan, on 27 February 2013 - 01:17 PM, said:

I'm actually not ignoring it.  I just think he's a regular season hero, who can never get it done in the playoffs.  Hell, the only reason the team he beat for his only playoff win was even in the game was because of his turnovers.  If Pete Carrol didn't call that time out, another Falcons playoff loss would've been all his fault.

Flacco also wins in the playoffs. Consistently.  How anyone can put Ryan over Flacco now, especially after this year, is ridiculous.

I think you need to read this... http://www.grantland...e-championships

#16 CardinalScotts

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 01:22 PM

there is so much more that goes into playing QB- I will say it's hard to beat Ryan's weapons to throw to

#17 Dean Cain

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 01:26 PM

I think Matty Ice has top 5 weapons: Top 10 veteran receiver Roddy White - check, Top 5 young receiver rising star, Julio Jones - check, Top 5 veteran tight end, greates tight end in nfl history, Tony Gonzalez - check.

As for himself Ryan is good but he isn't too mobile, and his arm is average. He reminds me a lot of Carson Palmer without the injuries.

#18 FireChan

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 01:30 PM

View PostBillsrhody, on 27 February 2013 - 01:20 PM, said:

I think you need to read this... http://www.grantland...e-championships

I gave it a shot, the author tries to be funny, but I can't tell which paragraph is the real argument with the sarcastic quips every two seconds.

One part I just love, it really sticks out to me.

"In the second half, Atlanta had five drives. Two ended on Ryan turnovers, one was a three-and-out, one ended on downs, and the fifth was the one in which Ryan threw a Hail Mary 40 yards too short. It wasn't just that one wheel route. Ryan had a bad second hal— But it is that wheel route! If Douglas doesn't fall down on the wheel route, he scores a touchdown and the Falcons probably win."

This is the worst picking at straws to spread the blame I've ever seen.  If Atlanta scores on one of those 5 drives, the author says they probably win the game.  1 of those 5 drives ended with someone other than the QB making a mistake.  4 of the 5 drives ended with the QB making a mistake, or not getting it done.  Obviously it's all Douglas' fault, not the QB!

Give me a break.  That author is just trying to defend a QB who couldn't get it done.  Hypothetical are ridiculous. "If CJ Spiller ran for 24 TD's and 2500 yards this season, we would've made the playoffs!"

Edited by FireChan, 27 February 2013 - 01:35 PM.


#19 T master

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 01:36 PM

I wonder what you might be saying about him if he was our QB & led our team to the AFC championship game ??

#20 Billsrhody

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 01:42 PM

View PostBigCountryBills, on 27 February 2013 - 01:26 PM, said:

I think Matty Ice has top 5 weapons: Top 10 veteran receiver Roddy White - check, Top 5 young receiver rising star, Julio Jones - check, Top 5 veteran tight end, greates tight end in nfl history, Tony Gonzalez - check.

As for himself Ryan is good but he isn't too mobile, and his arm is average. He reminds me a lot of Carson Palmer without the injuries.

Dont forget about his run game.. which is average at best.

View PostFireChan, on 27 February 2013 - 01:30 PM, said:

I gave it a shot, the author tries to be funny, but I can't tell which paragraph is the real argument with the sarcastic quips every two seconds.

One part I just love, it really sticks out to me.

"In the second half, Atlanta had five drives. Two ended on Ryan turnovers, one was a three-and-out, one ended on downs, and the fifth was the one in which Ryan threw a Hail Mary 40 yards too short. It wasn't just that one wheel route. Ryan had a bad second hal— But it is that wheel route! If Douglas doesn't fall down on the wheel route, he scores a touchdown and the Falcons probably win."

This is the worst picking at straws to spread the blame I've ever seen.  If Atlanta scores on one of those 5 drives, the author says they probably win the game.  1 of those 5 drives ended with someone other than the QB making a mistake.  4 of the 5 drives ended with the QB making a mistake, or not getting it done.  Obviously it's all Douglas' fault, not the QB!

Give me a break.  That author is just trying to defend a QB who couldn't get it done.  Hypothetical are ridiculous. "If CJ Spiller ran for 24 TD's and 2500 yards this season, we would've made the playoffs!"

The interesting part comes in closer to the bottom where he compares Ryan's career to Peyton Manning (who also had no playoff success in his first 8 years) and to Tom Brady. In the case of Brady, if you were to reverse his career, people would be calling him a choke artist. Right now nobody does that because of his wins early in his career.

Also, its easy to look at W/L record in the playoffs to criticize a QB.. but that isnt always the best way. In AFC championship 2 years ago, Flacco played well enough to beat the pats, but his kicker blew the game for him. The same goes for Ryan in this years playoffs. He played well enough to win, but because of the defense and a stumble from a receiver, he was the loser.