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Pat Williams retiring a Viking?


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#1 MrLocke

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Posted 23 April 2013 - 10:27 PM

Anyone else really disappointed about this: http://profootballta...e-with-vikings/ ?

I remember making my first post on the Stadium Wall that I thought the Bills run defense would suffer when they lost Pat Williams. I knew Ron Edwards didn't have what it took in run defense to replace Williams. A little disappointed as the Bills brought him into the league and he spent 2 more years with Buffalo than Minnesota. Letting him go is just further proof Donahoe didn't know what he was doing.

#2 mrags

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Posted 23 April 2013 - 10:29 PM

We never should have let him go.

#3 BmoreBills

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Posted 23 April 2013 - 10:34 PM

Two BIGGEST mistakes- letting Pat Williams go and drafting Mike Williams instead of drafting Bryant McKinnie. FACT.... we handed the Vikings two Pro Bowlers!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

#4 San Jose Bills Fan

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Posted 23 April 2013 - 11:20 PM

View PostMrLocke, on 23 April 2013 - 10:27 PM, said:

Anyone else really disappointed about this: http://profootballta...e-with-vikings/ ?



Pat played for the Bills for 8 years and the Vikings for 6 years.

Also, Pat was an undrafted free agent who the Bills brought into the NFL so there's that.

If the Bills weren't such a shabby organization that treated him poorly, he would be retiring as a Bill.

Unfortunately the Bills are a shabby organization that treated him poorly.

I'm not disappointed in Pat.

I'm disappointed in the Bills.

I'm guessing that's what you meant.


#5 Buftex

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Posted 23 April 2013 - 11:44 PM

I seem to recall that many here (not necessarily anyone in this thread), including some of the more revered posters on the board, were really all for the Bills getting rid of "fat Pat".  One of these illustrious posters (an old friend who doesn't post here any more) even broke down Williams play, and came to the conclusion that he was hardly ever on the field at key times (maybe why they were losing?)...and surely wasn't worth a raise.

I don't remember it all now...but I seem to remember being in the minority on the "letting Pat Williams go is a big mistake".  It seems to be an accepted fact now... the same way some ridicule anyone who thinks letting a productive player go (think David Nelson or Donald Jones), because, "after all, haven't the Bills proved by now that they know what they are doing? What do fans know?"

I notice when it comes to issues like this, people get very emotional about Ralph WIlsons' money.

Edited by Buftex, 23 April 2013 - 11:47 PM.


#6 MrLocke

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 12:15 AM

View PostSan Jose Bills Fan, on 23 April 2013 - 11:20 PM, said:



Pat played for the Bills for 8 years and the Vikings for 6 years.

Also, Pat was an undrafted free agent who the Bills brought into the NFL so there's that.

If the Bills weren't such a shabby organization that treated him poorly, he would be retiring as a Bill.

Unfortunately the Bills are a shabby organization that treated him poorly.

I'm not disappointed in Pat.

I'm disappointed in the Bills.

I'm guessing that's what you meant.


That's exactly what I meant. IIRC Thurman Thomas said if Ralph had thanked him and asked him to retire a Bill he never would have played that season for the Dolphins. It pained me so much to see him in a Dolphins jersey.

View PostBuftex, on 23 April 2013 - 11:44 PM, said:

I seem to recall that many here (not necessarily anyone in this thread), including some of the more revered posters on the board, were really all for the Bills getting rid of "fat Pat".  One of these illustrious posters (an old friend who doesn't post here any more) even broke down Williams play, and came to the conclusion that he was hardly ever on the field at key times (maybe why they were losing?)...and surely wasn't worth a raise.

I don't remember it all now...but I seem to remember being in the minority on the "letting Pat Williams go is a big mistake".  It seems to be an accepted fact now... the same way some ridicule anyone who thinks letting a productive player go (think David Nelson or Donald Jones), because, "after all, haven't the Bills proved by now that they know what they are doing? What do fans know?"

I notice when it comes to issues like this, people get very emotional about Ralph WIlsons' money.

I remember people compared tackle & sack totals for him and Ron Edwards. Sacks have nothing to do with run defense and it's possible to be good against the run without ever making a tackle. In Pat's case he occupied 2 blockers a lot of the time freeing up linebackers to make the tackle on the back.

#7 NoSaint

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 12:16 AM

I'm sorry but common sense said that one of the heaviest guys in the league wouldn't stick around to be the oldest defensive player in the nfl, just like an undersized middle linebacker wouldn't be in the top 5 oldest.... We managed to get bit on both guys. There's some element of dumb luck there. It'd be like signing dansby today and having him play out two full contracts while everyone's screaming stop gap or bandaid (if not over the hill already)

#8 benderbender

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 12:37 AM

Casey Hampton is available right now. Nobody is calling to pick him up. I think he's I'm the same situation: Steelers going younger and just assume he's going to fade away. I'd love to have him taking the center AND guard out on running plays for us.

#9 NoSaint

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 12:50 AM

View Postbenderbender, on 24 April 2013 - 12:37 AM, said:

Casey Hampton is available right now. Nobody is calling to pick him up. I think he's I'm the same situation: Steelers going younger and just assume he's going to fade away. I'd love to have him taking the center AND guard out on running plays for us.

A guy that size, that age just shouldn't have the knees and back to hold up. Every now and again it happens

#10 Shamrock

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 03:48 AM

He reminded me of Jerry Ball, a big guy that was explosive Ball played well for like a decade too. It seemed he had the leverage, bulk & size to protect his nees compared to say a Stubblefied who got more upright in the middle & injuries ate at his production more quickly.

#11 Kellyto83TD

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 08:15 AM

View PostMrLocke, on 23 April 2013 - 10:27 PM, said:

Anyone else really disappointed about this: http://profootballta...e-with-vikings/ ?

I remember making my first post on the Stadium Wall that I thought the Bills run defense would suffer when they lost Pat Williams. I knew Ron Edwards didn't have what it took in run defense to replace Williams. A little disappointed as the Bills brought him into the league and he spent 2 more years with Buffalo than Minnesota. Letting him go is just further proof Donahoe didn't know what he was doing.

Why wouldn't he? We didn't draft him AND this org said he wasn't worth the money and let him go. Honestly if I were him I would say F#@! Buffalo. And if any of you were actual players in the same situation you would say the same.

#12 BmoreBills

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 08:51 AM

View PostBuftex, on 23 April 2013 - 11:44 PM, said:

I seem to recall that many here (not necessarily anyone in this thread), including some of the more revered posters on the board, were really all for the Bills getting rid of "fat Pat".
I do not remember THAT much of that attitude... for the most part everyone was angry we let him go, because he was a big force in the middle.

Edited by BmoreBills, 24 April 2013 - 08:51 AM.


#13 Cash

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 09:40 AM

View PostSan Jose Bills Fan, on 23 April 2013 - 11:20 PM, said:



Pat played for the Bills for 8 years and the Vikings for 6 years.

Also, Pat was an undrafted free agent who the Bills brought into the NFL so there's that.

If the Bills weren't such a shabby organization that treated him poorly, he would be retiring as a Bill.

Unfortunately the Bills are a shabby organization that treated him poorly.

I'm not disappointed in Pat.

I'm disappointed in the Bills.

I'm guessing that's what you meant.


Agree 100%.  Always loved Pat Williams.

#14 Enemarty

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 09:49 AM

View PostBmoreBills, on 24 April 2013 - 08:51 AM, said:

I do not remember THAT much of that attitude... for the most part everyone was angry we let him go, because he was a big force in the middle.

As I recall, the issue wasn't Pat's play, which everyone was behind, but who deserved the big free agent contract, Pat or Jonas Jennings.  Most on this board thought LT was more important.

Of course, Jennings rejected our offer and bolted to the 49ers.  When we turned to Pat, he had had enough of the front office and went to the Vikes.

#15 Peter

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 09:52 AM

Does Big Pat still live in Buffalo?

I seem to recall that he had a business upgrading cars and that he still maintained a home in Buffalo for at least a period of time.

#16 BmoreBills

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 09:53 AM

View PostEnemarty, on 24 April 2013 - 09:49 AM, said:

As I recall, the issue wasn't Pat's play, which everyone was behind, but who deserved the big free agent contract, Pat or Jonas Jennings.  Most on this board thought LT was more important.

Of course, Jennings rejected our offer and bolted to the 49ers.  When we turned to Pat, he had had enough of the front office and went to the Vikes.
I never gave one thought about Jennings... our offensive line was pretty much a patchwork of guys anyways, but our defensive line was beast. I would have kept Big Pat and Big Ted FOREVER.... :P

#17 Enemarty

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 09:57 AM

View PostBmoreBills, on 24 April 2013 - 09:53 AM, said:

I never gave one thought about Jennings... our offensive line was pretty much a patchwork of guys anyways, but our defensive line was beast. I would have kept Big Pat and Big Ted FOREVER.... :P

Then you were in the minority on here.  The longest post I ever made on this board was in support of letting Jennings walk and keeping Pat and his buddy Sam together.

#18 Kellyto83TD

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 09:58 AM

View PostEnemarty, on 24 April 2013 - 09:49 AM, said:

As I recall, the issue wasn't Pat's play, which everyone was behind, but who deserved the big free agent contract, Pat or Jonas Jennings.  Most on this board thought LT was more important.

Of course, Jennings rejected our offer and bolted to the 49ers.  When we turned to Pat, he had had enough of the front office and went to the Vikes.

The issue was Tom Donahe didn't think he was worth the money at his age etc.  It was one of many moves that bit Tom in the ass

#19 MrLocke

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 10:06 AM

View PostNoSaint, on 24 April 2013 - 12:16 AM, said:

I'm sorry but common sense said that one of the heaviest guys in the league wouldn't stick around to be the oldest defensive player in the nfl, just like an undersized middle linebacker wouldn't be in the top 5 oldest.... We managed to get bit on both guys. There's some element of dumb luck there. It'd be like signing dansby today and having him play out two full contracts while everyone's screaming stop gap or bandaid (if not over the hill already)

That's bologna. Pat Williams was much like Fred Jackson in that his chronological age doesn't reflect the wear and tear on his body. Pat didn't really play his first few seasons in the league so really when he left he was in the prime of his career. Also Pat Williams didn't start a game untill his 4th season in the league and didn't become a full time starter untill his 5th.

View PostKellyto83TD, on 24 April 2013 - 08:15 AM, said:

Why wouldn't he? We didn't draft him AND this org said he wasn't worth the money and let him go. Honestly if I were him I would say F#@! Buffalo. And if any of you were actual players in the same situation you would say the same.

Yeah, like I said earlier in the thread more disappointed in the Bills than Pat.

Edited by MrLocke, 24 April 2013 - 10:03 AM.


#20 NoSaint

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 10:08 AM

View PostMrLocke, on 24 April 2013 - 10:00 AM, said:



That's bologna. Pat Williams was much like Fred Jackson in that his chronological age doesn't reflect the wear and tear on his body. Pat didn't really play his first few seasons in the league so really when he left he was in the prime of his career.

yes, because a 350 lbs man that has been that size long term only has knee and back troubles from playing football.

it wasnt the right move, but it looks A LOT worse in hindsight than it did with foresight. you NEVER bank on a guy that big playing as long as he did. was it fair to say he had a couple years left? sure. is it fair to say it was obvious he would be in the probowl 4-5 years down the line? absolutely not.