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EJ says this offense is easier than Florida State's ...


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#1 Lothar

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 03:41 AM

Wait, what? I guess you can read this in one of two ways but I'm not quite sure what this says about our new offense ...

http://profootballta...florida-states/



#2 nucci

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 04:32 AM

The K-Gun was a very simple offense. It's the players that are important.

#3 John Adams

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 04:32 AM

It's great. You don't need a complicated offense to win. You need the right offense.

Fitz could run a complicated offense. Where did that get them? The players are more important.

Edited by John Adams, 20 May 2013 - 04:34 AM.


#4 Corp000085

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 04:38 AM

Wasn't the K Gun based off of a half dozen plays or something?  As others have mentioned, its a matter of execution by the players.

#5 Nanker

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 05:04 AM

Nice read here on how simple Joe Gibbs' offense was.

#6 26CornerBlitz

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 05:10 AM

View PostLothar, on 20 May 2013 - 03:41 AM, said:

Wait, what? I guess you can read this in one of two ways but I'm not quite sure what this says about our new offense ...

http://profootballta...florida-states/

Already being discussed here---------> http://forums.twobil...40#entry2813013

#7 BobChalmers

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 05:25 AM

View Post26CornerBlitz, on 20 May 2013 - 05:10 AM, said:

Already being discussed here---------> http://forums.twobil...40#entry2813013

These two threads are in no way similar - suggest you reconsider and delete.

This thread is specific to EJ's comments about the simplicity of the ofensee - IE it is more about Hackett and the offense that EJ as a player.

#8 matter2003

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 05:26 AM

The Colts offense under Manning was very simple too with only a handful of plays. Executing it to perfection and great players are much more important...

#9 FeartheLosing

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 05:26 AM

View PostJohn Adams, on 20 May 2013 - 04:32 AM, said:

It's great. You don't need a complicated offense to win. You need the right offense.

Fitz could run a complicated offense. Where did that get them? The players are more important.
Bill Parcells would go over the game plan before Sunday and throw out all but about 20 of the offensive plays his QB liked to run the most.

The fact that no other QB seemed to have the ability to run Chan's complex offense but Fitz I think is exactly what got Gailey fired. Its my opinion that OC's need to keep it simple, and perhaps change formations / sets to confuse the opposing defense, but not your own players.

I also think that because the play book has been simplified it will be EJ's job to lose. Clearly Marrone / Hackett have simplified the offensive game plan for the rookie to have an easier time developing.

#10 frogger

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 05:28 AM

My high School coach taught me it is not the plays that matter, it is how they are ran.  The Defense can know your offense, even know the play but if you run them perfectly you'll win.  Now that was in basketball, and clearly football is different but I think its true, plus it may just be terms.  I am pretty sure the playbook will continue to grow as well.
Though, I did enjoys the comments posted by readers, I am hopeful they were not self hating bills fans.

Edited by frogger, 20 May 2013 - 05:29 AM.


#11 Nanker

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 05:35 AM

If ANYONE thinks that the entire playbook was divulged to Sir Manuel - including himself - then they're likely to be fooling themselves. Terminology aside, there are always lots of wrinkles that get added along the way. According to Jim Miller, Chan Gailey simplified Ron Erhardt's system.

Chalk this up as more head faking by the new sheriff in town.

#12 eball

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 05:38 AM

I see someone already mentioned it above, but wasn't the K-Gun about as simplistic an offense as there could be?  The "smarts" of a QB come with (a) knowing the plays and (b) reading the defense.  Why not make part (a) as easy and simple as possible?

#13 vincec

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 05:53 AM

View PostLothar, on 20 May 2013 - 03:41 AM, said:

Wait, what? I guess you can read this in one of two ways but I'm not quite sure what this says about our new offense ...

http://profootballta...florida-states/
Dick Jauron is back.

View PostJohn Adams, on 20 May 2013 - 04:32 AM, said:

It's great. You don't need a complicated offense to win. You need the right offense.

Fitz could run a complicated offense. Where did that get them? The players are more important.
So let me see if I got this straight:

Wannstedt's defense was very simple and that's bad because it was too predictable and not sophisticated enough for the NFL.  The Bills are in much better shape with Pettine and his new complex defense.

Hackett's offense is very simple and that's good because you don't need a complex offense to be effective you only need to have good players and run the plays well.  That sounds like what Wanny had told us.

View PostNanker, on 20 May 2013 - 05:35 AM, said:

If ANYONE thinks that the entire playbook was divulged to Sir Manuel - including himself - then they're likely to be fooling themselves.
I'll buy this.  The complexity is going to ramp up as Manuel starts to learn things.

Edited by vincec, 20 May 2013 - 05:52 AM.


#14 Hater

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 06:26 AM

You have to execute your Offence, doesn't matter how complex it is or isn't , if Doug Marrone is running a simplified offence if its by plays or terminology that's good for a young QB, EJ will learn in the NFL no matter how easy it looks you have to execute

#15 simpleman

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 06:28 AM

I wouldn't read too much into EJ's comments. If I was going into a job interview I would not say, "Boy this job is tougher  and more confusing than anything I have ever done". I would go into it and say "I get it, I am so excited about doing this job, and I am positive I will do great in this job". EJ is not the starting QB yet, he has 2 other competitors for the job, 3 if you want to be literal.
He is a smart guy who wants to win the job of starting QB. He will naturally say things that will win him the job, not make public comments that might instill doubts in the minds of the people that will decide if he wins the job.

#16 playman

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 06:28 AM

yup. jimmies and joes

#17 Mr. WEO

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 06:32 AM

It's encouraging to see that, in a week, he has "mastered the playbook".

And this: "This offense is very simple.  I’ve done a great job with it.”

#18 Kellyto83TD

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 06:41 AM

Jim Kelly had 15 pass plays and 8-10 Running plays each game. He just moved guys and changed routes within those plays as he saw the Defense.  You don't need an overly complicated offense to succeed in the NFL. It has been my opinion that if you make it too complex you are hurting yourself.

#19 uncle flap

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 06:44 AM

View Postvincec, on 20 May 2013 - 05:53 AM, said:


So let me see if I got this straight:

Wannstedt's defense was very simple and that's bad because it was too predictable and not sophisticated enough for the NFL.  The Bills are in much better shape with Pettine and his new complex defense.

Hackett's offense is very simple and that's good because you don't need a complex offense to be effective you only need to have good players and run the plays well.  That sounds like what Wanny had told us.


Predictable doesn't equal simple and vice versa.

I don't know much about FSU's offense, but I'm guessing based on EJ's comments, that there were multiple progressions and adjustments to be made on a given play, based on the defensive formation/personnel. For example, play #1 called in the huddle is ran  a number of different ways. If D is showing man and two deep safeties, he looks at receiver X first, then Z, then Y. If zone, then Y, then X, then Z. Then the WRs may be expected to adjust routes based on the same variables. Now we're getting complex, even if it is a one or two read offense, since those one or two reads are going to vary significantly snap to snap, even when the same play is called.

OTOH, it sounds like Hackett is teaching: When we call play #1, the progression is always X, then Y, then Z. The WR is going to run the same route, so EJ doesn't have to worry that the WR remembers his "hot" route or make any adjustments at the line based on the defense.

You can run 15 different plays out of a number of formations that are "simple" in design without being predictable.

Even 15 different plays that can be run or pass, short or deep, etc., can be unpredictable. Heck, you can put one formation out there where you can run, pass, or play action pass without tipping off the defense.

Meanwhile, Wanny basically ran three different plays the entire year, without disguising what they were doing at all. To compare Wanny's D to an offensive scheme would be like lining up in a heavy TE set and running to the strong side EVERY time, without sprinkling in a counter, much less a play action pass.

#20 Dorkington

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 06:48 AM

IMO, it's all about the audible. If a QB can recognize what the defense is going to do and audible into the right play call/hot route, then who cares how simple the offense is.