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Kevin Kolb different kind of QB competition.


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#1 br1ju

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Posted 03 July 2013 - 06:13 AM

http://www.buffalobi...92-cb3cb2cf82a5

Not much new here but was really bored waiting for the season to start. Not sure if allowed to post by the way, if not mods please delete. One thing to note on the article was when he mentioned how he was part of a team where it was clear who the coach wanted to succeed. Having watched Arizona the past few seasons I had an inkling that Kolb didn't fit with what Arizona was doing and that Skelton was more suited for what Whiz wanted to run over there. That may have explained why Skelton got the nod over Kolb as the starter last year even though it was clear Kolb was the better talent.

#2 Chandler#81

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Posted 03 July 2013 - 06:44 AM

The Second Reich

#3 mrags

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Posted 03 July 2013 - 08:34 AM

View PostChandler#81, on 03 July 2013 - 06:44 AM, said:

The Second Reich
just as long as the Third Reich doesn't reform.

#4 chris heff

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Posted 03 July 2013 - 08:45 AM

View Postbr1ju, on 03 July 2013 - 06:13 AM, said:

http://www.buffalobi...92-cb3cb2cf82a5

Not much new here but was really bored waiting for the season to start. Not sure if allowed to post by the way, if not mods please delete. One thing to note on the article was when he mentioned how he was part of a team where it was clear who the coach wanted to succeed. Having watched Arizona the past few seasons I had an inkling that Kolb didn't fit with what Arizona was doing and that Skelton was more suited for what Whiz wanted to run over there. That may have explained why Skelton got the nod over Kolb as the starter last year even though it was clear Kolb was the better talent.
Wasn't Whisenhunt he coach when they traded for Kolb? Didn't the GM consult with the coach before the trade? Whisenhunt most definatly was involved in that decision. Why would he be on board with trading for a guy that didn't fit his system? After that trade Kolb would have been given every opportunity to be the starter. I don't buy that he didn't fit Whisenhunt's system. The fact remains that Kolb has been given the opportunity to start twice by two different coaching staffs and lost the job both times.

Kolb's comment that he doesn't "buy what is being sold" is dulusional. Does he think that the Blls drafted Manuel in the first round to be a back up? Of course they view Manual as the future, any suggestion to the contrary is absurd.

#5 Chandler#81

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Posted 03 July 2013 - 08:54 AM

View Postchris heff, on 03 July 2013 - 08:45 AM, said:


Wasn't Whisenhunt he coach when they traded for Kolb? Didn't the GM consult with the coach before the trade? Whisenhunt most definatly was involved in that decision. Why would he be on board with trading for a guy that didn't fit his system? After that trade Kolb would have been given every opportunity to be the starter. I don't buy that he didn't fit Whisenhunt's system. The fact remains that Kolb has been given the opportunity to start twice by two different coaching staffs and lost the job both times.

Kolb's comment that he doesn't "buy what is being sold" is dulusional. Does he think that the Blls drafted Manuel in the first round to be a back up? Of course they view Manual as the future, any suggestion to the contrary is absurd.

I agree, CH, but really, what other public spin could he put on it. He's professional enough to know its very likely the back-up QB (sooner or later) will see the field in this League and he loves playing and earning a great paycheck. We're all in agreement he has a better, stronger arm than Fitz so he'll keep defenses honest just by his skills. I don't think it's absurd that he takes a very professional public stance.

#6 Alphadawg7

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Posted 03 July 2013 - 09:20 AM

View Postchris heff, on 03 July 2013 - 08:45 AM, said:


Wasn't Whisenhunt he coach when they traded for Kolb? Didn't the GM consult with the coach before the trade? Whisenhunt most definatly was involved in that decision. Why would he be on board with trading for a guy that didn't fit his system? After that trade Kolb would have been given every opportunity to be the starter. I don't buy that he didn't fit Whisenhunt's system. The fact remains that Kolb has been given the opportunity to start twice by two different coaching staffs and lost the job both times.

Kolb's comment that he doesn't "buy what is being sold" is dulusional. Does he think that the Blls drafted Manuel in the first round to be a back up? Of course they view Manual as the future, any suggestion to the contrary is absurd.

He didn't lose his job in Philly, he got hurt at beginning of season and then Vick exploded that season.

#7 br1ju

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Posted 03 July 2013 - 09:25 AM

View Postchris heff, on 03 July 2013 - 08:45 AM, said:


Wasn't Whisenhunt he coach when they traded for Kolb? Didn't the GM consult with the coach before the trade? Whisenhunt most definatly was involved in that decision. Why would he be on board with trading for a guy that didn't fit his system? After that trade Kolb would have been given every opportunity to be the starter. I don't buy that he didn't fit Whisenhunt's system. The fact remains that Kolb has been given the opportunity to start twice by two different coaching staffs and lost the job both times.

Kolb's comment that he doesn't "buy what is being sold" is dulusional. Does he think that the Blls drafted Manuel in the first round to be a back up? Of course they view Manual as the future, any suggestion to the contrary is absurd.

I wrote a whole spill on a different thread when someone asked the same question. Thank goodness for cut and paste. This is what I wrote:

Whisenhunt absolutely had input, the question was to what degree? Graves (their GM at the time) had majority control over player personnel and at the time Arizona had run through a gamut of QB's after Warner retired and needed some stability. There was a lot of pressure to deliver because fans were getting restless. Enter Kolb who had just lost his job to Vick and was the hottest QB in the market. The need along with Kolb's demand precipitated to a deal. You have to remember the circumstances as well, due to the strike shortened off-season there was essentially no time for coaches, and GMs to really sit and discuss, look at enough game tape and do their due dilligence on Kolb. He was obtained a couple weeks prior to their first pre-season game which further put him at a disadvantage to learn a completely different system. At the end of the day Whisenhunt did want Kolb to a certain degree and felt he was their best option at that point, but the problem was that he tried fitting a square peg through a circle.

As for the whole "I don't buy it" statement, you have to put yourself in his shoes. He was drafted as the heir apparent in Philadelphia and look how that played out. I don't blame him for saying that as it could also mean he's very confident in what he could accomplish in Buffalo. I'm not arguing for his position but just trying to be level headed about the QB situation.

Manuel has impressed thus far with his demeanor and approach as a QB ( I really liked the fact that he spoke with Aaron Rodgers) but let's face it, until they put pads on we really don't know what we have in him.

#8 chris heff

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Posted 03 July 2013 - 11:10 AM

View PostChandler#81, on 03 July 2013 - 08:54 AM, said:



I agree, CH, but really, what other public spin could he put on it. He's professional enough to know its very likely the back-up QB (sooner or later) will see the field in this League and he loves playing and earning a great paycheck. We're all in agreement he has a better, stronger arm than Fitz so he'll keep defenses honest just by his skills. I don't think it's absurd that he takes a very professional public stance.
I don't think he is taking a professional stance. He intimates that at either Philly or Arizona he was not given a fair shot. What I think is absurd is the statement that the Bills don't view Manuel as the future.

View PostAlphadawg7, on 03 July 2013 - 09:20 AM, said:



He didn't lose his job in Philly, he got hurt at beginning of season and then Vick exploded that season.
I think that Philly's signing of Vick was in and of itself an indication of the concern that staff had for Kolb. He was a second round pick, he had been there for a couple of years. So the coaches knew him. He had been named the heir apparent. Yet he loses his job because of injury and is subsequently traded.

View Postbr1ju, on 03 July 2013 - 09:25 AM, said:



I wrote a whole spill on a different thread when someone asked the same question. Thank goodness for cut and paste. This is what I wrote:

Whisenhunt absolutely had input, the question was to what degree? Graves (their GM at the time) had majority control over player personnel and at the time Arizona had run through a gamut of QB's after Warner retired and needed some stability. There was a lot of pressure to deliver because fans were getting restless. Enter Kolb who had just lost his job to Vick and was the hottest QB in the market. The need along with Kolb's demand precipitated to a deal. You have to remember the circumstances as well, due to the strike shortened off-season there was essentially no time for coaches, and GMs to really sit and discuss, look at enough game tape and do their due dilligence on Kolb. He was obtained a couple weeks prior to their first pre-season game which further put him at a disadvantage to learn a completely different system. At the end of the day Whisenhunt did want Kolb to a certain degree and felt he was their best option at that point, but the problem was that he tried fitting a square peg through a circle.

As for the whole "I don't buy it" statement, you have to put yourself in his shoes. He was drafted as the heir apparent in Philadelphia and look how that played out. I don't blame him for saying that as it could also mean he's very confident in what he could accomplish in Buffalo. I'm not arguing for his position but just trying to be level headed about the QB situation.

Manuel has impressed thus far with his demeanor and approach as a QB ( I really liked the fact that he spoke with Aaron Rodgers) but let's face it, until they put pads on we really don't know what we have in him.
The strike would have given them more time to look at film. The coaches weren't on strike.

Kolb lost his job in Philly, he was on the team for a few years. They drafted him to be the QB of the future not as trade bait. Yet he doesn't believe that the Bills drafted E.J. as the QB of the future? It's a dumb think to say.

#9 4merper4mer

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Posted 03 July 2013 - 11:11 AM

I was hopeful that Kolb could be a good stop gap/backup/potential starter until I saw that article.  Did you see the picture of Kolb and how the helmet fits funny with the mask angling down?  How many successful QBs have you seen with a helmet that looks so ridiculous?

#10 Marcellosaurus

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Posted 03 July 2013 - 11:23 AM

View Post4merper4mer, on 03 July 2013 - 11:11 AM, said:

I was hopeful that Kolb could be a good stop gap/backup/potential starter until I saw that article.  Did you see the picture of Kolb and how the helmet fits funny with the mask angling down?  How many successful QBs have you seen with a helmet that looks so ridiculous?

Good point. I've always been completely shocked with the lack of respect for players' face masks angles on this board. Totally underrated aspect of what makes a QB successful.

#11 Chandler#81

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Posted 03 July 2013 - 01:05 PM

View PostMarcellosaurus, on 03 July 2013 - 11:23 AM, said:



Good point. I've always been completely shocked with the lack of respect for players' face masks angles on this board. Totally underrated aspect of what makes a QB successful.

Agreed! Kemp and Thiesman wore a single bar slanted to the ground. They sucked!

#12 4merper4mer

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Posted 03 July 2013 - 01:38 PM

View PostMarcellosaurus, on 03 July 2013 - 11:23 AM, said:

Good point. I've always been completely shocked with the lack of respect for players' face masks angles on this board. Totally underrated aspect of what makes a QB successful.

It's the whole helmet that bothers me, not just the mask.

#13 chris heff

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Posted 03 July 2013 - 01:43 PM

View PostMarcellosaurus, on 03 July 2013 - 11:23 AM, said:



Good point. I've always been completely shocked with the lack of respect for players' face masks angles on this board. Totally underrated aspect of what makes a QB successful.
Are there any pictures of Manuel? With his Bills helmet not FSU. The NFL is a completely different game.

#14 San Jose Bills Fan

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Posted 03 July 2013 - 05:59 PM

View PostMarcellosaurus, on 03 July 2013 - 11:23 AM, said:

Good point. I've always been completely shocked with the lack of respect for players' face masks angles on this board. Totally underrated aspect of what makes a QB successful.

I too, can't believe the lack of respect on this board for player' face mask angles.

#15 mrags

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Posted 06 July 2013 - 10:35 AM

Holy crap, whoever wore this facemask/helmet must have been horrible.

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#16 Speedy G

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Posted 06 July 2013 - 11:00 AM

View Postchris heff, on 03 July 2013 - 08:45 AM, said:


Wasn't Whisenhunt he coach when they traded for Kolb? Didn't the GM consult with the coach before the trade? Whisenhunt most definatly was involved in that decision. Why would he be on board with trading for a guy that didn't fit his system? After that trade Kolb would have been given every opportunity to be the starter. I don't buy that he didn't fit Whisenhunt's system. The fact remains that Kolb has been given the opportunity to start twice by two different coaching staffs and lost the job both times.

Kolb's comment that he doesn't "buy what is being sold" is dulusional. Does he think that the Blls drafted Manuel in the first round to be a back up? Of course they view Manual as the future, any suggestion to the contrary is absurd.

Of course E.J. Is the future ! Kolb is here until he's ready, and if Kolb performs well enough, (i.e. wins games) , E.J. will be learning all along that journey and be ready to play lights out when the time is right!! Forget all the drama!..lets hope this is the start of something Awesome!! Go Bills ��

#17 Corp000085

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Posted 06 July 2013 - 11:08 AM

View Postmrags, on 06 July 2013 - 10:35 AM, said:

Holy crap, whoever wore this facemask/helmet must have been horrible.

That Y. A. Tittle guy sucked all the way to the hall of fame.

#18 chris heff

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Posted 06 July 2013 - 11:22 AM

View PostSpeedy G, on 06 July 2013 - 11:00 AM, said:



Of course E.J. Is the future ! Kolb is here until he's ready, and if Kolb performs well enough, (i.e. wins games) , E.J. will be learning all along that journey and be ready to play lights out when the time is right!! Forget all the drama!..lets hope this is the start of something Awesome!! Go Bills ��
Except that Kolb said "I don't buy what's being sold I guess". This was his response to EJ being viewed as the long term answer..

#19 Buffalo Bob

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Posted 06 July 2013 - 12:12 PM

View PostCorp000085, on 06 July 2013 - 11:08 AM, said:



That Y. A. Tittle guy sucked all the way to the hall of fame.

Can you imagine how much better he'd have been if he played with the proper face ask angle?

#20 jaybee

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Posted 06 July 2013 - 12:36 PM

View Postchris heff, on 06 July 2013 - 11:22 AM, said:

Except that Kolb said "I don't buy what's being sold I guess". This was his response to EJ being viewed as the long term answer..

On the other hand that "could" be interpreted as the response of a competitor.  The situation will play out whichever way but you've got to believe the guy is hungry.  I'm OK with that response personally.  I mean, its better than "I really look forward to being a backup".

jb