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Holding call on punt


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#1 Jerry Jone's Toupee

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Posted 15 September 2013 - 03:51 PM

Can anyone explain the automatic 1st down on that call?

#2 JR in Pittsburgh

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Posted 15 September 2013 - 03:54 PM

I think the rule is that if the hold occurs before the ball is kicked, it's like defensive holding on a pass-- 5 yards and automatic 1st down.

If it happens after the kick, the the receiving team keeps the ball and its just assessed after change of possession (like a hold occurring during a return).

#3 sullim4

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Posted 15 September 2013 - 03:54 PM

Prior to the punt = defensive holding which is a 5 yd penalty and automatic first down.

#4 kdiggz

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Posted 15 September 2013 - 03:56 PM

He held an eligible receiver apparently before the ball was kicked. 5 yards and automatic first down just like it would be if their offense was on the field.

#5 Doc

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Posted 15 September 2013 - 03:56 PM

It's stupid.  On a punt, a hold won't prevent a first down.

#6 MrLocke

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Posted 15 September 2013 - 03:57 PM

Summers deserved to be cut for that play. I was angry. The Aaron Williams play was a boneheaded penalty.

#7 justnzane

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Posted 15 September 2013 - 04:02 PM

View Postkdiggz, on 15 September 2013 - 03:56 PM, said:

He held an eligible receiver apparently before the ball was kicked. 5 yards and automatic first down just like it would be if their offense was on the field.

The hold wasn't on a receiver. Nonetheless, it is still a holding call if a defensive player holds an offensive player regardless of position (if he doesn't have the ball).

#8 The Big Cat

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Posted 15 September 2013 - 04:03 PM

Looked like it came after the kick though. Whatever. It was a lousy call to set THEM up for a TD, and we got one back with the PI.

#9 ko12010

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Posted 15 September 2013 - 04:06 PM

View PostThe Big Cat, on 15 September 2013 - 04:03 PM, said:

Looked like it came after the kick though. Whatever. It was a lousy call to set THEM up for a TD, and we got one back with the PI.
I agree with the first part, but we didn't get one back on the PI. That was a legit penalty. This bogus holding call wasn't.

#10 CSBill

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Posted 15 September 2013 - 04:06 PM

View PostMrLocke, on 15 September 2013 - 03:57 PM, said:

Summers deserved to be cut for that play. I was angry. The Aaron Williams play was a boneheaded penalty.

Both were just stupid, stupid, stupid plays.

#11 A Dog Named Kelso

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Posted 15 September 2013 - 04:08 PM

I believe since technically the team could fake from that formation that is why that call would result in a first down.  I could be wrong but that is the only reason I could come up with.

#12 Wayne Cubed

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Posted 15 September 2013 - 04:10 PM

View Postko12010, on 15 September 2013 - 04:06 PM, said:

I agree with the first part, but we didn't get one back on the PI. That was a legit penalty. This bogus holding call wasn't.

Agreed, that was a legit PI call. The holding call left me scratching my head, mostly because it was 4th and 18, that hold didn't prevent them from getting a 1st down.

Odd call.

#13 Fixxxer

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Posted 15 September 2013 - 04:12 PM

Can someone confirm if John Conner is currently a FA? Not impressed with Summers' blocking, he was awful against a DB today (EJ's fumble play)

#14 ko12010

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Posted 15 September 2013 - 04:19 PM

View PostWayne Cubed, on 15 September 2013 - 04:10 PM, said:

Agreed, that was a legit PI call. The holding call left me scratching my head, mostly because it was 4th and 18, that hold didn't prevent them from getting a 1st down.

Odd call.
Exactly. Whether the hold started before or after the kick was iffy at best. No reason to call that there. If anything, if it's that close, call it as after the kick and let them have 4th and 13. These ridiculous calls are what get fans and teams so upset. No reason to call that there and it seriously almost cost the Bills a win. The zebras need to think smarter on their feet. I know it's a tough job for them to be super accurate, but they need to improve. Absolute joke. If we lose that game, the season's in jeopardy, and because of the youth of this team across the board, I don't think that's an exaggeration.

#15 Bob in STL

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Posted 15 September 2013 - 04:19 PM

View PostFixxxer, on 15 September 2013 - 04:12 PM, said:

Can someone confirm if John Conner is currently a FA? Not impressed with Summers' blocking, he was awful against a DB today (EJ's fumble play)

Yes, John Conner is a free agent but currently at large.  Apparently still hiding from TheTerminator.

#16 BillsFan-4-Ever

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Posted 15 September 2013 - 04:21 PM

the refs are lucky the Bills won...  or else they'd be dodging a bunch of stuff thrown at them as they left the parking lots.

#17 gobillsinytown

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Posted 15 September 2013 - 04:22 PM

View PostBob in STL, on 15 September 2013 - 04:19 PM, said:

Yes, John Conner is a free agent but currently at large.  Apparently still hiding from TheTerminator.

No I think he's protecting his sister Sarah........

#18 BillnutinHouston

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Posted 15 September 2013 - 04:26 PM

Good thread.  Was wondering about this myself.  The rule makes sense BTW.  Will have to look at the tape and see if the hold (which was blatant BTW, he ripped off the player's helmet) was pre or post kick.

#19 ko12010

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Posted 15 September 2013 - 04:27 PM

View Postgobillsinytown, on 15 September 2013 - 04:22 PM, said:

No I think he's protecting his sister Sarah........
Haha, my first thought. Was thinking the poster was making a Terminator joke or something

#20 Kkspike

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Posted 15 September 2013 - 04:28 PM

John Conner neck is toast.