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Mike Silver on Andre Reed HOF


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#1 FluffHead

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Posted 20 November 2013 - 10:28 PM

NFLN is broadcasting a show analyzing the HOF announcement of the 25 semi finalists. A panel is debating Tim Brown vs Andre Reed. 3 of the four panelists say they believe Reed gets in before Brown.

Then Silver goes on to say someone has to explain to him why Andre Reed quit in a playoff game before he ever views him as a HOFer.   It was a pretty damning statement. When questioned what game Andre "quit" in, Silver says something along the lines of "I don't know, I think I remember something, maybe at the end of his career, I'm not sure".

After such a strong accusation for him to basically say that he doesn't even really remember if that happened or not, made him seem like an unprofessional douche who had an axe to grind. Thank god he doesn't really have a vote.

Does anyone remember Andre quitting in the playoffs?  I believe he was once ejected but that is different

#2 BuffaloBill

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Posted 20 November 2013 - 10:31 PM

Not at all.

A journalist should be able to easily fact check the assertion.

#3 flomoe

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Posted 20 November 2013 - 10:44 PM

View PostBuffaloBill, on 20 November 2013 - 10:31 PM, said:

Not at all.

A journalist should be able to easily fact check the assertion.

I think nowadays, that ship has sailed in journalism (see MSNBC, CNBC, NBC.........)
It's what is reported that counts. not the substance or truth of the reporting. If that was the case, the current President wouldn't be the current President.

In terms of the HOF, there seems to be a leaning towards players with a very partial media behind them (Sapp, Irvin, Carter) and a few others that I just can't think of off the top of my head but the bias is there.........and yes, possibly the numbers for those players might help them but they still don't stack up with some players of the 60's, 70's or 80's when the game was a bit different overall.

#4 Big C

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Posted 20 November 2013 - 11:00 PM

Mike Silver was also the only columnist on NFL.com to pick the Bills as the last wild card team. So I don't know how I feel about him on the whole.

#5 mrags

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Posted 20 November 2013 - 11:04 PM

View Postflomoe, on 20 November 2013 - 10:44 PM, said:



I think nowadays, that ship has sailed in journalism (see MSNBC, CNBC, NBC.........)
It's what is reported that counts. not the substance or truth of the reporting. If that was the case, the current President wouldn't be the current President.

In terms of the HOF, there seems to be a leaning towards players with a very partial media behind them (Sapp, Irvin, Carter) and a few others that I just can't think of off the top of my head but the bias is there.........and yes, possibly the numbers for those players might help them but they still don't stack up with some players of the 60's, 70's or 80's when the game was a bit different overall.
this totally gets me realizing one thing. It's been said before I'm sure but here's the best way to say it.

It's the Hall of FAME,

Not the...

Hall of Stats.

It's that simple. We know Andre because we are Bills fans. Because he was probably the best WR we ever had. But people outside the Buffalo circle really don't.

#6 Aaron

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Posted 20 November 2013 - 11:09 PM

He's probably thinking of the Dolphins game where the ref was hovering behind Reed and he stood up and got a penalty.

#7 Buftex

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Posted 20 November 2013 - 11:13 PM

Silver is an idiot if he did indeed say that.  Reed got a 15 yard unsportsmanlike conduct flag thrown at him in SB 26,because he was incensed that he was being interfered with constantly....this particular flag, as I recall, came on a third down play, and took the Bills out of field goal range...the game was not a blowout yet, so it was viewed as costly.   He was also ejected from the 1998 playoff game against the Dolphins, in the final moments, when the ref ruled that he hadn't broken the plane of the endzone as time was running down...as you recall, Flutie was stripped of the ball on the next play by Trace Armstrong...as time ran out.   Reed never quit a playoff game... just curious how Silver will view his NFLN co-worker,  LaDanian Tomlinson when he is eligible...

#8 GG

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Posted 20 November 2013 - 11:18 PM

Maybe he's talking about THE drop in SB XXV?

#9 Buftex

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Posted 20 November 2013 - 11:22 PM

View Postmrags, on 20 November 2013 - 11:04 PM, said:

this totally gets me realizing one thing. It's been said before I'm sure but here's the best way to say it.

It's the Hall of FAME,

Not the...

Hall of Stats.

It's that simple. We know Andre because we are Bills fans. Because he was probably the best WR we ever had. But people outside the Buffalo circle really don't.
  Your point is a little confusing, but I think I know what you are trying to say.  I would only counter that with the fact that I am more than sure that anyone voting for the Hall of Fame knows who Andre Reed is,  and football fan, no matter where they lived, or what team they root for, knows full well who Andre Reed is, if they were born, say, before 1975.  He was one of the top players in the game at his position, for about 5 years, on a team that won a **** load of football games...and his contributions to their winning was very substantial.  Do you think people all over the country know who Willie Roaf or Will Shields are?  If the answer is no, does that mean they don't deserve HOF recognition?  Might as well start making the Tim Tebow bust now....

View PostGG, on 20 November 2013 - 11:18 PM, said:

Maybe he's talking about THE drop in SB XXV?
  Or maybe he just doesn't know wtf he is talking about?  That is where I am putting my money...besides, did Reed have a huge, clutch time, dropped pass in SB25 that I am forgetting?

#10 GG

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Posted 20 November 2013 - 11:25 PM

View PostBuftex, on 20 November 2013 - 11:22 PM, said:

...besides, did Reed have a huge, clutch time, dropped pass in SB25 that I am forgetting?

There was the one critical 3rd & 1 alligator drop that helped change the momentum...

#11 Just Jack

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Posted 20 November 2013 - 11:33 PM

View PostGG, on 20 November 2013 - 11:25 PM, said:

There was the one critical 3rd & 1 alligator drop that helped change the momentum...

Here's the PbP...

http://www.pro-footb...#pbp_data::none

#12 SBUffalo

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Posted 20 November 2013 - 11:44 PM

This is my view on Andre Reed's HoF status: Individually, he's not a Hall of Famer. It's not that big of a travesty that he's not in. HOWEVER, as part of the Buffalo Bills team that went to the Superbowl an unprecedented FOUR times in a row, he is a Hall of Famer. He was one of the "big four" players, and should be in because of the part he played in that.

#13 mrags

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Posted 21 November 2013 - 01:02 AM

View PostBuftex, on 20 November 2013 - 11:22 PM, said:


  Your point is a little confusing, but I think I know what you are trying to say.  I would only counter that with the fact that I am more than sure that anyone voting for the Hall of Fame knows who Andre Reed is,  and football fan, no matter where they lived, or what team they root for, knows full well who Andre Reed is, if they were born, say, before 1975.  He was one of the top players in the game at his position, for about 5 years, on a team that won a **** load of football games...and his contributions to their winning was very substantial.  Do you think people all over the country know who Willie Roaf or Will Shields are?  If the answer is no, does that mean they don't deserve HOF recognition?  Might as well start making the Tim Tebow bust now....


  Or maybe he just doesn't know wtf he is talking about?  That is where I am putting my money...besides, did Reed have a huge, clutch time, dropped pass in SB25 that I am forgetting?
the difference between Reed and Roaf and Shields are that those guys were arguably the best at their positions not only at that time but overall. Reed wasn't ever near the best in any given season. Over time he was fantastic.

#14 Dragonborn10

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Posted 21 November 2013 - 01:29 AM

Let's face the facts.  The Bills win one SB and Reed, Hull, and maybe even Tasker make the HOF.  Without that one win then all the comparisons start to kick in.  I would have no issue with Reed not making it if they had not selected Art Monk.  No matter the number of catches he had nobody game planned to stop Art Monk.  But when they selected Monk, Reed should have been next in line before Irvin.  He was a more dominant player than Monk and Reed had far better stats than Irvin.  Monk wasn't even the best WR on his team.

As for Tim Brown I never saw him as a HOF reciever.  I suspect people in Oakland feel the same way about Reed.

#15 mrags

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Posted 21 November 2013 - 01:32 AM

View PostDragonborn10, on 21 November 2013 - 01:29 AM, said:

Let's face the facts.  The Bills win one SB and Reed, Hull, and maybe even Tasker make the HOF.  Without that one win then all the comparisons start to kick in.  I would have no issue with Reed not making it if they had not selected Art Monk.  No matter the number of catches he had nobody game planned to stop Art Monk.  But when they selected Monk, Reed should have been next in line before Irvin.  He was a more dominant player than Monk and Reed had far better stats than Irvin.  Monk wasn't even the best WR on his team.

As for Tim Brown I never saw him as a HOF reciever.  I suspect people in Oakland feel the same way about Reed.
Irvin was a feared WR that teams had to gameplan for. Reed was successful due to the trixie offense the Bills ran at the time.

#16 Corp000085

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Posted 21 November 2013 - 05:45 AM

View Postmrags, on 21 November 2013 - 01:32 AM, said:

Irvin was a feared WR that teams had to gameplan for. Reed was successful due to the trixie offense the Bills ran at the time.

Trixie offense?  If anyone is a hall of fame, it is Ted Marchibroda.  That offense was not trixie, it was a philosophical, wholesale change that is still being used today.  

Now to the topic at hand...  As an individual player, Andre Reed is not a Hall of Famer. He was good, consistent, and he was the best weapon available to the Bills.  Compared to his contemporaries, he was one of the best at his position.  By that token, Andre Reed is an excellent Hall of Very Good member.  As the sum of the parts, the Buffalo Bills of the 1990s were a devastating force that other teams feared for a run of about 8 years.  Andre Reed was a huge part of that.  If Andre's career is captured as a part of that dominating team, he IS a Hall of Famer.  On that note, I'm going to reserve a hotel room in Canton in August!

#17 bowery4

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Posted 21 November 2013 - 09:13 AM

I'm sorry but Andre was better than Irving, to lazy to find the link but if I remember right even his stats said so. Man this is so long ago..... HOF every year Andre has been dissed, I hope he gets in there this year.

#18 Carey Bender

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Posted 21 November 2013 - 09:25 AM

Silver tweeted regarding this last night:

"To clarify re Andre Reed. Great Player. Was accused of dogging it in 95 playoff loss to Steelers. Kelly and Thomas got mad on sidelines...I'm not saying Reed quit, or that he's not a Hall of Famer. I would just want an explanation. He obviously came back and balled in 96...In retrospect I should have asked these questions before airing the long-ago complaint on TV. I will do some research and revisit. In the meantime...Bills fans old enough to remember that 95 loss to the Steelers and it's aftermath know exactly what I'm talking about."

Edited by Carey Bender, 21 November 2013 - 09:26 AM.


#19 mchammer

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Posted 21 November 2013 - 09:31 AM

I think it's a standing joke amongst voting sports reporters that they put Andre's name in the mix but never select him. His numbers will look worse against current players as time goes on because the game has changed from what it was. It's become more of a passing game and you see players like Welker racking up unheard of numbers.

#20 NoSaint

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Posted 21 November 2013 - 09:33 AM

View PostCarey Bender, on 21 November 2013 - 09:25 AM, said:

Silver tweeted regarding this last night:

"To clarify re Andre Reed. Great Player. Was accused of dogging it in 95 playoff loss to Steelers. Kelly and Thomas got mad on sidelines...I'm not saying Reed quit, or that he's not a Hall of Famer. I would just want an explanation. He obviously came back and balled in 96...In retrospect I should have asked these questions before airing the long-ago complaint on TV. I will do some research and revisit. In the meantime...Bills fans old enough to remember that 95 loss to the Steelers and it's aftermath know exactly what I'm talking about."

i know thurman isnt one to be quiet on twitter. curious to see how he reacts. been awhile since weve had an "on like a mofo" themed thread