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Poloncarz confirms there are suitors who want to move the team


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#1 YoloinOhio

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Posted 02 June 2014 - 06:45 AM

ProFootballTalk@ProFootballTalk 36m
Bills have suitors who would buy the team and move it http://wp.me/p14QSB-9uDv

"It may not go for $2 billion in Buffalo, but it could go for $2 billion or more if the buyer is intent on dog-paddling through six seasons in Buffalo before moving to the Los Angeles media market."

Edited by YoloinOhio, 02 June 2014 - 06:46 AM.


#2 dollars 2 donuts

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Posted 02 June 2014 - 06:51 AM

Seriously, if you were one of the mega billionaires what do you care or worry about if the stadium is empty for a number of years?

What p****s me off is that right after the bills are sold and then moved the NFL will enact rules to make moving a team more difficult.

...I mean jeepers you can just feel it's going to happen.

Btw, all the while as the sales process plays itself out a few silent voices descending on deaf ears will try and remind purchasers and nfl fans that there are 7-10 million people within 100 miles of Buffalo to no avail.

Edited by dollars 2 donuts, 02 June 2014 - 06:54 AM.


#3 Fingon

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Posted 02 June 2014 - 06:58 AM

Can NFL teams sell local TV packages now? No, so stop worrying about the team going for $2 billion + and moving to LA. The new owner can't just start an "LA Bills Network" to recover the cost of buying the franchise. Luxury boxes won't be enough to cover $2 billion for the team, $1 billion for a stadium, probably another $1 billion in relocation fees. Not to mention playing in an empty stadium for 6 more years.

#4 YoloinOhio

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Posted 02 June 2014 - 07:01 AM

I know there is a "fiduciary responsibility" there but I thought I read that the trustees were committed to not selling to a suitor who wanted to move the team, regardless. Whether Golisano offers $1B or a guy worth 31B who wants to move it to LA but offers $4b, they were going to sell to the highest bidder who shows they will keep the team here. Sounds like Poloncarz is questioning that, and Brandon can't comment.

View PostFingon, on 02 June 2014 - 06:58 AM, said:

Can NFL teams sell local TV packages now? No, so stop worrying about the team going for $2 billion + and moving to LA. The new owner can't just start an "LA Bills Network" to recover the cost of buying the franchise. Luxury boxes won't be enough to cover $2 billion for the team, $1 billion for a stadium, probably another $1 billion in relocation fees. Not to mention playing in an empty stadium for 6 more years.
The Chargers should move to LA. Their stadium and fan base are crap there, they can't sell out, and they have fans all over SoCal. They need a new stadium, can't get one, and are on a year to year lease with Qualcomm. Someone please move there!

#5 Fingon

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Posted 02 June 2014 - 07:06 AM

View PostYoloinOhio, on 02 June 2014 - 07:01 AM, said:

I know there is a "fiduciary responsibility" there but I thought I read that the trustees were committed to not selling to a suitor who wanted to move the team, regardless. Whether Golisano offers $1B or a guy worth 31B who wants to move it to LA but offers $4b, they were going to sell to the highest bidder who shows they will keep the team here. Sounds like Poloncarz is questioning that, and Brandon can't comment.

The Chargers should move to LA. Their stadium and fan base are crap there, they can't sell out, and they have fans all over SoCal. They need a new stadium, can't get one, and are on a year to year lease with Qualcomm. Someone please move there!
I'm pretty sure the Chargers claim LA as part of their market. That's one of the reasons that the NFL will impose a very large relocation fee on an LA franchise. There isn't as huge of a difference in value between the LA market and Buffalo market because the TV money is locked in regardless of location. Luxury boxes can only do so much, as all non-box ticket money is pooled and split between the 32 teams.

Edited by Fingon, 02 June 2014 - 07:06 AM.


#6 shrader

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Posted 02 June 2014 - 07:09 AM

Waiting out six years is a pretty risky move seeing as how someone else could move to LA before them.  It sure would be nice to see an asshat with that kind of plan spend $2 billion and then have to sell the team for $1 billion.

#7 nucci

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Posted 02 June 2014 - 07:16 AM

View PostYoloinOhio, on 02 June 2014 - 06:45 AM, said:

ProFootballTalk@ProFootballTalk 36m
Bills have suitors who would buy the team and move it http://wp.me/p14QSB-9uDv

"It may not go for $2 billion in Buffalo, but it could go for $2 billion or more if the buyer is intent on dog-paddling through six seasons in Buffalo before moving to the Los Angeles media market."
Not really surprising.

#8 FeartheLosing

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Posted 02 June 2014 - 07:18 AM

Didn't we already know there are at least two groups that want to move the team to Toronto? Probably there are others who are thinking of LA, England or wherever they can maximize profits.

Like I've stated before Trump wouldn't be that bad if he keeps the team in Buffalo, and there are others who we know will keep the team in western NY.

The team is currently worth 870 mill, and will probably sell for north of one billion. Although I doubt it goes over 1.5.

#9 All_Pro_Bills

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Posted 02 June 2014 - 07:28 AM

View Postdollars 2 donuts, on 02 June 2014 - 06:51 AM, said:

Seriously, if you were one of the mega billionaires what do you care or worry about if the stadium is empty for a number of years?
The league would not want to see a scenario like this play out.  Teams generally move for two reasons, lack of a facility and lack of fan support.  Neither appear to be an issue with the Bills going forward.  Given that moving for the sake of higher revenues while an obvious objective of any team might be too blantant obvious for the league to consider.  And the bid process is not a auction, but rather an evaluation of many factors one of which is price.  Along with this several owners have already gone on record as saying their preference to keep the team in WNY given great fan support and concrete plans for a new stadium in place.  The votes to support relocation might not be there.  I suspect much of what is happening with the new stadium proposals is designed to have a plan in place prior to the bid reviews, making support for relocation harder to come by with the owners.

The other thing is I am just weary of the LA story and if that happens it would be a major shock to me.  If the decision process was solely dollars and cents then one of the 30 teams not playing in the NYC market would have jumped at the chance to move to LA since they could surely make more money playing there.  What's it been about 20 years without a team?  Nobody rushing out to the west coast to pluck the gem of markets?  How about the Packers, Steelers, Bengals?  Hey, even the Cowboys should be able to make more in Los Angeles than Dallas.  More viewers, more people, right?  

From a football perspective I've never liked the LA market upon examination of the demographics.  Teams have left there in the past and not much has changed.  The region has lots of transplants from elsewhere that are fans of other teams with large Asian and Latin communities that don't put American football at the top of their sports preferences.  You probably have a bigger group of hardcore fans in Buffalo.  The only attraction is the corporate sector but that doesn't fill the stadium.  And with the amount of noise and support the corporate box occupants produce you can hear a pin drop at the 50 yard line.

Edited by All_Pro_Bills, 02 June 2014 - 07:54 AM.


#10 Wayne Cubed

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Posted 02 June 2014 - 07:36 AM

Over the weekend I happened to catch A Football Life:  1995 Cleveland Browns. Very interesting for those who haven't seen it. I don't think the NFL want's to see what played out their happen again in Buffalo, just my opinion though.

Also, there's this:

http://www.sfvbj.com...going-downtown/

LA has officially given up on the downtown stadium. No team is going to move to LA with out a firm stadium plan in place, which they can't even get right.

#11 TaskersGhost

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Posted 02 June 2014 - 07:44 AM

View Postdollars 2 donuts, on 02 June 2014 - 06:51 AM, said:

Seriously, if you were one of the mega billionaires what do you care or worry about if the stadium is empty for a number of years?

What p****s me off is that right after the bills are sold and then moved the NFL will enact rules to make moving a team more difficult.

...I mean jeepers you can just feel it's going to happen.

Btw, all the while as the sales process plays itself out a few silent voices descending on deaf ears will try and remind purchasers and nfl fans that there are 7-10 million people within 100 miles of Buffalo to no avail.

7-10 million within 100 miles?  Say WHAT?   If we had half of that there wouldn't be any problem.

What pisses me off is that Wilson could easily have sold the team to an owner with a stated desire and interest in keeping the team in the region.  Meanwhile, there are some that still believe, for unbeknownst reasons, that Wilson "did all that he could to keep the team in Buffalo."  Yeah, right.   I got so sick and tired of hearing that in the years before he croaked given that obvious situation.

PS   I guess enough time has now passed since Wilson's kicking that it's all going to start coming out now.

#12 Wayne Cubed

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Posted 02 June 2014 - 07:46 AM

View PostTaskersGhost, on 02 June 2014 - 07:44 AM, said:

7-10 million within 100 miles?  Say WHAT?   If we had half of that there wouldn't be any problem.

Toronto...

#13 frogger

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Posted 02 June 2014 - 07:47 AM

Does the team have to be bought by the highest bidder?  Does the Wilson family have any say in who buys the team?

#14 TaskersGhost

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Posted 02 June 2014 - 07:47 AM

View PostFingon, on 02 June 2014 - 06:58 AM, said:

Can NFL teams sell local TV packages now? No, so stop worrying about the team going for $2 billion + and moving to LA. The new owner can't just start an "LA Bills Network" to recover the cost of buying the franchise. Luxury boxes won't be enough to cover $2 billion for the team, $1 billion for a stadium, probably another $1 billion in relocation fees. Not to mention playing in an empty stadium for 6 more years.

You and others don't get it.  They'll never cover the costs in any city as long as taxpayer funding/money for a stadium is involved.  But that's a different matter, it has absolutely nothing to do with a sale like this.  Even in Buffalo if they built a new stadium they wouldn't have enough to cover the cost.  They don't now, they've had to bilk taxpayers to cover the expenses of business owners, aka NFL owners, aka Wilson.

It's a simple matter of where can a team make more money, here or elsewhere.  Clearly there are a number of markets ripe for an NFL team that could do much much better for their owner and which would be in a better position than NYS/EC to build a stadium.  NYS doesn't have a pot to piss in anymore.

#15 Mr. WEO

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Posted 02 June 2014 - 07:51 AM

Shocking news.  And I happen to know that one of these potential buyer groups is led by a certain pop/rock recording artist from the 1980's (I will not reveal his name at this time, but he is well known)....

#16 Fingon

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Posted 02 June 2014 - 07:53 AM

View PostTaskersGhost, on 02 June 2014 - 07:47 AM, said:

You and others don't get it.  They'll never cover the costs in any city as long as taxpayer funding/money for a stadium is involved.  But that's a different matter, it has absolutely nothing to do with a sale like this.  Even in Buffalo if they built a new stadium they wouldn't have enough to cover the cost.  They don't now, they've had to bilk taxpayers to cover the expenses of business owners, aka NFL owners, aka Wilson.

It's a simple matter of where can a team make more money, here or elsewhere.  Clearly there are a number of markets ripe for an NFL team that could do much much better for their owner and which would be in a better position than NYS/EC to build a stadium.  NYS doesn't have a pot to piss in anymore.
Actually, it seems that you are the one that doesn't get it. Have you ever worked for a business before? Spending $1 billion to keep the team in Buffalo is much more profitable than $4 billion to move to LA. Especially since the vast majority of NFL revenue is the same regardless of franchise location. Do you think you get more TV money because you are in a larger market?

#17 TaskersGhost

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Posted 02 June 2014 - 07:57 AM

View PostYoloinOhio, on 02 June 2014 - 07:01 AM, said:

I know there is a "fiduciary responsibility" there but I thought I read that the trustees were committed to not selling to a suitor who wanted to move the team, regardless. Whether Golisano offers $1B or a guy worth 31B who wants to move it to LA but offers $4b, they were going to sell to the highest bidder who shows they will keep the team here. Sounds like Poloncarz is questioning that, and Brandon can't comment.

You know what it sounds like to me, ... common sense really, that Brandon and Polancarz fully understand that it's an uphill battle to keep the team in the region.  That they're exploring all options to do so.  That they don't want to suggest that the odds of the team staying may be closer to 10% than to 90-100% like many here seem to BILL-ieve.

This isn't a fairy tale, it's modern America where money is all that matters and the desires of the uber wealthy are all that matter.

Take Wilson for instance.  You really think he cared about anything but himself and the inheretence he'd leave his family?  Please!  He could have sold the team to Golosano, Peguda, Trump, or anyone else that agreed to keep it in Buffalo, but instead he's arranged to have it sold upon his death and now we've heard, several times, that it will be to the highest bidder.  I'd bet anything that that's exactly who's going to be buying it, the highest bidder.

I'm just curious how many fans still view Ralph as some great guy that really did what he could, or even a small amount besides throwing an anchor on the team, while it still sucks, to stick around for a few more seasons.

That's a fact, Wilson could have arranged, perhaps even posthumously, to have sold the team to someone willing to keep it here.  The other fact is that he did not do that.  At this point, every dime that the estate makes is pure profit off of his original purchase price of $25K, which in today's NFL terms is about a penny.  I guess $800M, even after taxes, isn't enough for his family to live on.

Meanwhile, watch, the team will go to the playoffs the season before it moves.

View PostFeartheLosing, on 02 June 2014 - 07:18 AM, said:

The team is currently worth 870 mill, and will probably sell for north of one billion. Although I doubt it goes over 1.5.

Again, you're missing the point.  A month ago if anyone had been asked about the value of the Clippers, we'd be having the same conversation here, that the Clippers wouldn't sell for anymore than $1B if that.

These people have way too much money for everyone else's good.

#18 K-9

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Posted 02 June 2014 - 08:01 AM

View PostFingon, on 02 June 2014 - 07:53 AM, said:

Actually, it seems that you are the one that doesn't get it. Have you ever worked for a business before? Spending $1 billion to keep the team in Buffalo is much more profitable than $4 billion to move to LA. Especially since the vast majority of NFL revenue is the same regardless of franchise location. Do you think you get more TV money because you are in a larger market?

I've said it a million times, moving a team to LA or any other "large TV market" wouldn't even move the needle on TV ratings. And LA is a two-edged sword in that regard because local advertisers who pay a premium in the first place, aren't happy when the home team's games either aren't shown locally because they don't sell out or, worse, the ratings are behind other programming in that time slot. This was a regular occurrence when the Rams and Raiders were in LA. It was embarrassing for the league to come in behind reruns of 'Gilligan's Island' on a Sunday afternoon in the country's 2nd largest TV market.

GO BILLS!!!

#19 TaskersGhost

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Posted 02 June 2014 - 08:02 AM

View PostWayne Cubed, on 02 June 2014 - 07:46 AM, said:

Toronto...

Exactly.  And Toronto's been there for how long?  A few weeks?  No, for as long as the Bills have been in town and then some.

Clearly that's hardly a draw.  Let's be practical and realistic here.

Meanwhile, you say that if Toronto, what, the metro area ten times the size of Buffalo, with an enormous amount of much larger businesses and the financial hub of Canada and one of the largest few financial centers in the world, but the chances of moving the team to Toronto are slim to nil.

Figure out which it is.  If Toronto's a factor as you imply, then the team's moving to Toronto, not sitting in a paltry little city barely making the top-100 in size in the US without a single Fortune 500 company and not even close to enough corporate dollars to regularly fill luxury suites, is the outcome.

BTW, this L.A. thing in the piece was a red herring.

#20 thebandit27

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Posted 02 June 2014 - 08:03 AM

View PostTaskersGhost, on 02 June 2014 - 07:57 AM, said:

That's a fact, Wilson could have arranged, perhaps even posthumously, to have sold the team to someone willing to keep it here.  The other fact is that he did not do that.  At this point, every dime that the estate makes is pure profit off of his original purchase price of $25K, which in today's NFL terms is about a penny.  I guess $800M, even after taxes, isn't enough for his family to live on.

Can we see some documentation confirming this fact?  Do you somehow know the terms of Ralph's trust?