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90% of all topics about the O , no talk about the D


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#1 mead107

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Posted 02 September 2014 - 04:33 PM

Seems like most of you are looking past our D.  

I think the D will keep us in each game.
EJ will only have to make a few plays for us to win.


In my opinion

#2 PromoTheRobot

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Posted 02 September 2014 - 04:39 PM

Not enough to fret about with the D but give us time. Going by the preseason the D will only be able to do so much.  The offense (EJ and 10 other guys) have to get something done.

Edited by PromoTheRobot, 02 September 2014 - 04:40 PM.


#3 voodoo poonani

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Posted 02 September 2014 - 04:46 PM

Our D will keep us in the first half. Second half they'll get worn out from all the three and outs on offense.  Same as what happened often last year.

#4 The Real Buffalo Joe

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Posted 02 September 2014 - 06:00 PM

Offense is our biggest question mark. Defense looks fine.

#5 Manther

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Posted 02 September 2014 - 06:10 PM

The offense has not scored TDs in the preseason.  But they have not been going 3 and out....which is positive.

#6 Graybeard

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Posted 02 September 2014 - 06:18 PM

View Postvoodoo poonani, on 02 September 2014 - 04:46 PM, said:

Our D will keep us in the first half. Second half they'll get worn out from all the three and outs on offense.  Same as what happened often last year.
:thumbsup: (unfortunately)

#7 KikoSeeBallKikoGetBall

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Posted 02 September 2014 - 08:21 PM

I'm excited about our run D. I think Bradham could make a name for himself this year.

#8 PolishDave

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Posted 02 September 2014 - 08:54 PM

I'm a little worried about the defense in all honesty.   I keep looking for rational thoughts why the pass defense will be as good as they were last year in terms of sacks and turnovers caused.   I just can't get there.

The personnel is good, but I don't know about the scheme.

I keep remembering how bad the Bills defense sucked when we had Wanny and how much Pettine turned it around.   I fear that we are going to really miss having Pettine on the staff.   If the Bills don't get good pressure on Chicago, then I don't think they have a shot at winning.   And my intuition tells me that Schwartz is nowhere near as aggressive as Pettine.  I like aggressive defenses that attack.  We had that last year.  I don't expect we will have that this year.   I have a strange suspicion that we will be better versus the run, maybe much better, but also worse versus the pass.

#9 Green Lightning

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Posted 02 September 2014 - 09:31 PM

TBD rule, all EJ, all the time. EJ playing on D as well would generate the threads you seek; i.e., if he played safety we could have a thread about whether he locks on to one receiver. If a CB, footwork. LB, slow eyes, and so forth.

#10 Gugny

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Posted 02 September 2014 - 09:36 PM

View Postmead107, on 02 September 2014 - 04:33 PM, said:

Seems like most of you are looking past our D.  

I think the D will keep us in each game.
EJ will only have to make a few plays for us to win.


In my opinion
Great point, Mead.  

I've thought, since the Fitz era, that the D is what kept us OUT of the playoffs.  Every year.  Including last year - even with Thad.

The offense has always scored enough points to win games.  The defense could never stop the run.  Even last year, they couldn't stop it when they needed to.  Sure, they sacked a bunch of guys and had good 1st and 2nd downs ... but teams kept moving chains and scoring points.

As much as people have been saying that the Bills will go as far as EJ takes them ... I disagree.  EJ is very well-equipped to lead the offense into scoring position.  He's proved that against great teams in REAL games.

If the defense can hold up its end of the bargain, the Bills will win games.  To me ... the Bills will go as far as the DEFENSE takes them; not EJ.

#11 SJDK

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Posted 02 September 2014 - 09:53 PM

I don't think we will see sack numbers like we did last year, mostly because teams will max protect on pass downs. That cat is out of the bag. Also, I don't think Schwartz will blitz as much and this may expose our corners. McLovins size will be exploited by larger recievers if that is the case. I think that we need a lot of pressure on Cutler or else those recievers will run a couple yards and jump straight up against Mckelvin all day. The best case scenario is that our D gets pressure without the blitz (rushing four with seven in coverage) and we stand the chance of getting interceptions. I think those concerns will hold true against most of our opponents. I do not think run D will dissapoint.

View Postmead107, on 02 September 2014 - 04:33 PM, said:

Seems like most of you are looking past our D.  

I think the D will keep us in each game.
EJ will only have to make a few plays for us to win.


In my opinion
This should be the case from what I have seen

#12 BlueFire

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Posted 02 September 2014 - 10:01 PM

View PostGugny, on 02 September 2014 - 09:36 PM, said:

Great point, Mead.  

I've thought, since the Fitz era, that the D is what kept us OUT of the playoffs.  Every year.  Including last year - even with Thad.

The offense has always scored enough points to win games.  The defense could never stop the run.  Even last year, they couldn't stop it when they needed to.  Sure, they sacked a bunch of guys and had good 1st and 2nd downs ... but teams kept moving chains and scoring points.

As much as people have been saying that the Bills will go as far as EJ takes them ... I disagree.  EJ is very well-equipped to lead the offense into scoring position.  He's proved that against great teams in REAL games.

If the defense can hold up its end of the bargain, the Bills will win games.  To me ... the Bills will go as far as the DEFENSE takes them; not EJ.

2013 Defense:

10th YPG
13th Scoring D
4th DVOA (Football Outsiders)

2013 Offense:

19th YPG
22nd Scoring O
25th DVOA (Football Outsiders)

I think it's pretty clear which side of the game limited us last year.

#13 PolishDave

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Posted 03 September 2014 - 06:29 AM

View PostBlueFire, on 02 September 2014 - 10:01 PM, said:

I think it's pretty clear which side of the game limited us last year.

No doubt.

That defense kept us in games that we otherwise had no business being in.   Like for example the Baltimore game.   Even when teams tried to hand us a win, like the Jets game in NY, the offense still struggled to do anything.

I think I personally place more value in sacks and turnovers than I think other people do.    I think sacks and turnovers are game changing plays that put your team in a position to win while also making for some extremely enjoyable football.

#14 BillsFan-4-Ever

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Posted 03 September 2014 - 07:37 AM

because the D was good last season and should be better this.


The O is Swiss Cheese until it can prove itself.

View PostManther, on 02 September 2014 - 06:10 PM, said:

The offense has not scored TDs in the preseason.  But they have not been going 3 and out....which is positive.
Preseason doesn't count.

0-4 preseason teams have won a SB , 4-0 preseason teams have gone 0-16

#15 kdiggz

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Posted 03 September 2014 - 07:46 AM

We will be talking about the D after Cutler burns the secondary for 300 yards on Sunday.  McKelvin looked terrible in his limited action and he's not going to get much help from Searcy unfortunately.  Gilmore is healthy so what's going to be his excuse this year?  Aaron Williams plays hard and looks good, we just can't expect him to be Jairus Byrd though.  Spikes is going to help us stuff the run but god help us if they decide to pass (which NFL offenses tend to do the majority of the time).  He couldn't cover a receiver in a phone booth if his life depended on it.  It all adds up to Cutler having a big day and us complaining about the D on monday

#16 Gugny

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Posted 03 September 2014 - 07:51 AM

View PostBlueFire, on 02 September 2014 - 10:01 PM, said:

2013 Defense:

10th YPG
13th Scoring D
4th DVOA (Football Outsiders)

2013 Offense:

19th YPG
22nd Scoring O
25th DVOA (Football Outsiders)

I think it's pretty clear which side of the game limited us last year.
Those are great statistics and I agree that the offense could have been better.  The D did a great job for much of most games ... the problem is they fell flat at the wrong times - which is not illustrated in these stats.

I'm not saying, by any means, that the offense was not the reason the Bills lost some games.  That would be silly.

But I find it equally as silly to say that the D was not the reason the Bills lost some games.

Here is a list of points scored by the Bills in games that they lost:

21
20
24
24
17
13
10
31
6
20

In 4/10 losses, the Bills scored less than 20 points.  In those 4 losses, they scored an average of 11.5 points.
In 6/10 losses, the Bills scored more than 20 points.  In those 6 losses, they scored an average of 23.33 points.

That inclines me to opine that the Bills scored enough points in enough games to have had a winning season last year, had the defense done its part.

Also, I think it's worth noting that this offense was being led by either Manual (rookie), Tuel (God-awful) or Lewis (serviceable, at best) for all 16 games.

The D proved that it could sack the QB a lot.  That's great.  It also proved that when they needed to stop teams at critical times, they couldn't do it.  There's no stat for that, but we all know it's true.

Go Bills.

#17 eball

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Posted 03 September 2014 - 07:53 AM

View PostPolishDave, on 03 September 2014 - 06:29 AM, said:

No doubt.

That defense kept us in games that we otherwise had no business being in.   Like for example the Baltimore game.   Even when teams tried to hand us a win, like the Jets game in NY, the offense still struggled to do anything.

You mean the Baltimore game in which the Bills rushed for 200+ yards and EJ threw a 40+ yard TD to Woods?  That Baltimore game?

Quote

I think I personally place more value in sacks and turnovers than I think other people do. I think sacks and turnovers are game changing plays that put your team in a position to win while also making for some extremely enjoyable football.

So are 80-yard runs.  Last year's Bills' defense reminded me of the '04 Bills' defense -- they will destroy bad teams but the good teams can still score at will.  This year's defense will be more of a complete unit.

#18 MyHorseAteTheKid

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Posted 03 September 2014 - 08:17 AM

View PostGugny, on 03 September 2014 - 07:51 AM, said:

Those are great statistics and I agree that the offense could have been better.  The D did a great job for much of most games ... the problem is they fell flat at the wrong times - which is not illustrated in these stats.

I'm not saying, by any means, that the offense was not the reason the Bills lost some games.  That would be silly.

But I find it equally as silly to say that the D was not the reason the Bills lost some games.

Here is a list of points scored by the Bills in games that they lost:

21
20
24
24
17
13
10
31
6
20

In 4/10 losses, the Bills scored less than 20 points.  In those 4 losses, they scored an average of 11.5 points.
In 6/10 losses, the Bills scored more than 20 points.  In those 6 losses, they scored an average of 23.33 points.

That inclines me to opine that the Bills scored enough points in enough games to have had a winning season last year, had the defense done its part.

Also, I think it's worth noting that this offense was being led by either Manual (rookie), Tuel (God-awful) or Lewis (serviceable, at best) for all 16 games.

The D proved that it could sack the QB a lot.  That's great.  It also proved that when they needed to stop teams at critical times, they couldn't do it.  There's no stat for that, but we all know it's true.

Go Bills.

View PostGugny, on 03 September 2014 - 07:51 AM, said:

Those are great statistics and I agree that the offense could have been better.  The D did a great job for much of most games ... the problem is they fell flat at the wrong times - which is not illustrated in these stats.

I'm not saying, by any means, that the offense was not the reason the Bills lost some games.  That would be silly.

But I find it equally as silly to say that the D was not the reason the Bills lost some games.

Here is a list of points scored by the Bills in games that they lost:

21
20
24
24
17
13
10
31
6
20

In 4/10 losses, the Bills scored less than 20 points.  In those 4 losses, they scored an average of 11.5 points.
In 6/10 losses, the Bills scored more than 20 points.  In those 6 losses, they scored an average of 23.33 points.

That inclines me to opine that the Bills scored enough points in enough games to have had a winning season last year, had the defense done its part.

Also, I think it's worth noting that this offense was being led by either Manual (rookie), Tuel (God-awful) or Lewis (serviceable, at best) for all 16 games.

The D proved that it could sack the QB a lot.  That's great.  It also proved that when they needed to stop teams at critical times, they couldn't do it.  There's no stat for that, but we all know it's true.

Go Bills.
  How many of those points were either scored by the Defense or came as a result of a turnover?

#19 Gugny

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Posted 03 September 2014 - 08:34 AM

View PostMyHorseAteTheKid, on 03 September 2014 - 08:17 AM, said:

How many of those points were either scored by the Defense or came as a result of a turnover?
I'm not !@#$ing Rainman.

My point was simply to share my opinion that the defense was just as culpable for the losing season last year as the offense; if not more.

#20 KD in CT

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Posted 03 September 2014 - 08:36 AM

What happened to the other 10%?