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This is not a rebuild, folks...


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#1 eball

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Posted 10 May 2017 - 08:00 AM

...and I find it amusing that posters are saying things like "give them three years and we'll see" and whatnot.

 

Yes, it's McD's first HC job, and yes, it's Beane's first GM job (although he did serve as interim GM for 10 games in 2012), but these guys are hardly "green" and the Bills' roster cupboard is far from bare.

 

I will be shocked if the Bills aren't at least a 6-7 win team, and I certainly think it's possible they could win 9 or 10.  This is not a rebuild, it's a refocus.



#2 Best Player Available

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Posted 10 May 2017 - 08:10 AM

...and I find it amusing that posters are saying things like "give them three years and we'll see" and whatnot.
 
Yes, it's McD's first HC job, and yes, it's Beane's first GM job (although he did serve as interim GM for 10 games in 2012), but these guys are hardly "green" and the Bills' roster cupboard is far from bare.
 
I will be shocked if the Bills aren't at least a 6-7 win team, and I certainly think it's possible they could win 9 or 10.  This is not a rebuild, it's a refocus.


If you don't think there will be major starting players affected by this. I don't inow what too say. It could start with dumping #14 next season Kyles retirement possibly forced. Wood getting up there. Clay concievably leaving in 18. A new QB, it's a rebuild.
Just so far not a complete teardown.

#3 May Day 10

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Posted 10 May 2017 - 08:14 AM

Unfortunately for us, it isnt.  6-9 wins is the problem.  They will keep striving for that.  

 

A bad schedule, the Pats tooling up for 14-15 wins....  just play dead a year, clear out cap room, acquire picks, put yourself in a position to get Darnold or one of the top 3 QBs... and live to fight in 2018 and beyond.



#4 papazoid

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Posted 10 May 2017 - 08:14 AM

rebuild

verb

To bring back to a previous normal condition:


#5 Chuck Wagon

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Posted 10 May 2017 - 08:15 AM

They aren't purposely tanking, but if you see 9-10 wins on this schedule you are certainly an optimist.  



#6 papazoid

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Posted 10 May 2017 - 08:17 AM

They aren't purposely tanking, but if you see 9-10 wins on this schedule you are certainly an optimist.  

 

what are you called if you see 19-0 baby !  ??



#7 Augie

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Posted 10 May 2017 - 08:22 AM

what are you called if you see 19-0 baby !  ??


Delusional? :)

#8 JohnC

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Posted 10 May 2017 - 08:26 AM



...and I find it amusing that posters are saying things like "give them three years and we'll see" and whatnot.

 

Yes, it's McD's first HC job, and yes, it's Beane's first GM job (although he did serve as interim GM for 10 games in 2012), but these guys are hardly "green" and the Bills' roster cupboard is far from bare.

 

I will be shocked if the Bills aren't at least a 6-7 win team, and I certainly think it's possible they could win 9 or 10.  This is not a rebuild, it's a refocus.

This is not a full-scale Cleveland Browns type of rebuild. That's clearly the case. But in my view this is a mini-rebuild that will take a few years before this team becomes a contending team. We can fruitlessly get into a semantical argument of the definition of a rebuild but what's the point in arguing that. What is very probable is that it is going to take at least three years to get back to being a serious team. 

 

The Bills are a 7 win caliber of team, reasonable arguments can be made for -1 or +1 from that estimate. It's going to take because of our qb situation at least another two or three years before it climbs out of its generational rut. 

 

With good coaching and smart personnel moves it wouldn't surprise me if this team got better although in the short run it still wasn't reflected by its record. 



#9 eball

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Posted 10 May 2017 - 08:42 AM

They aren't purposely tanking, but if you see 9-10 wins on this schedule you are certainly an optimist.  

 

I am generally optimistic but it happens every year.  This roster is already competitive.  You don't think a more structured and disciplined approach will lead to better results than under Rex?



#10 jmc12290

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Posted 10 May 2017 - 08:44 AM

 
I am generally optimistic but it happens every year.  This roster is already competitive.  You don't think a more structured and disciplined approach will lead to better results than under Rex?

This roster is overrated. The defense of 2014 is dead and buried. It ain't coming back with McDermott in 2017.

Edited by jmc12290, 10 May 2017 - 08:45 AM.


#11 Gugny

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Posted 10 May 2017 - 08:49 AM

They got rid of a half dozen of their most talented players.

 

They kept a painfully mediocre QB.

 

They have a first-time HC.

 

They have a first-time GM.

 

They are facing their toughest schedule in recent memory.

 

This is, indeed, a rebuild.  And it's about goddamn time.

 

At least with Beane being hired, it seems that McBeano will be the tandem for a few years to come.

 

I'd expect (pray/hope/beg for) a new QB next year and serious aspirations for a playoff run in 2019.



#12 KellyToughII

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Posted 10 May 2017 - 08:57 AM

They got rid of a half dozen of their most talented players.

 

They kept a painfully mediocre QB.

 

They have a first-time HC.

 

They have a first-time GM.

 

They are facing their toughest schedule in recent memory.

 

This is, indeed, a rebuild.  And it's about goddamn time.

 

At least with Beane being hired, it seems that McBeano will be the tandem for a few years to come.

 

I'd expect (pray/hope/beg for) a new QB next year and serious aspirations for a playoff run in 2019.

Its a retooling rebuild if that makes sense.  It allows us to transition to a full rebuild instead of just blowing it up.  I am torn, personally I would have blown it up, but lets see how it goes.



#13 Commonsense

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Posted 10 May 2017 - 08:59 AM

They got rid of a half dozen of their most talented players.
 
They kept a painfully mediocre QB.
 
They have a first-time HC.
 
They have a first-time GM.
 
They are facing their toughest schedule in recent memory.
 
This is, indeed, a rebuild.  And it's about goddamn time.
 
At least with Beane being hired, it seems that McBeano will be the tandem for a few years to come.
 
I'd expect (pray/hope/beg for) a new QB next year and serious aspirations for a playoff run in 2019.


Frame this one and put it on the wall. Perfectly said.

#14 Chuck Wagon

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Posted 10 May 2017 - 09:09 AM

 

I am generally optimistic but it happens every year.  This roster is already competitive.  You don't think a more structured and disciplined approach will lead to better results than under Rex?

 

 

I could see the OLine being better with the addition of Dawkins at RT, though there may be rookie growing pains.  I could see the defensive line being better with a full season from Lawson and a focused season from Dareus and a return to the better fit of a 4-3.  Everywhere else I think got worse or at best stayed the same:

 

CBs - Gilmore to White - downgrade, NRC gone, depth is a ????

WRs - Woods to Jones - ???? could go either way, depth is another ???

LBs - Zach Brown to Ragland - downgrade, can the linebackers play McD's scheme?

S - Graham & Williams to Hyde & Poyer (I'd feel better if we get Boston) -  ????  Could go either way

RB - Gillislee to ????

 

 

Yes, the coaching staff is bringing a more disciplined approach, but it's also a first time head coach and they are implementing a new offensive and defensive scheme, there are likely going to be growing pains.  I don't think we'll go 2-14 (we never do), but it's a tough schedule with a lot of changes and a lot of questions, I can't see a legitimate playoff push right now.


Edited by Chuck Wagon, 10 May 2017 - 09:12 AM.


#15 C.Biscuit97

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Posted 10 May 2017 - 09:13 AM

And because it's not a rebuild, it's why we always go 7-9 or 6-10 most seasons.

Yes, we could sneak into the playoffs and I will be very happy. But odds are we're winning 6 or 7 games & might not have the ammo to pick a top qb to end this mediocre cycle.

I believe this is a talent team. I think with a top qb we are easily a playoff team. Tyrod is fine and certainly not a major problem. But I don't know if he will ever be a difference maker. And until we get that, our margin for error is so small.

#16 vorpma

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Posted 10 May 2017 - 09:15 AM

Delusional? :)

:thumbsup:



#17 mjt328

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Posted 10 May 2017 - 09:16 AM

Even if McDermott/Beane are the perfect pairing, there may be some growing pains early.  It's very rare that a team overhauls its coaching staff and front office, then takes a big step forward the next season.  It usually takes the players time to adapt on the field to the coaching changes, and it takes some time for the GM's work to filter down through the roster.

 

There are some reasons to be optimistic, and hope we are the exception to the rule however:

 

1.  Rick Dennison was Tyrod Taylor's QB coach for a year, and allegedly tried to recruit him to the Broncos.  He should be very familiar with what Taylor does well and what he struggles with, so hopefully that means a step forward instead of a step backwards.

 

2.  The offensive line is experience with zone blocking concepts, so hopefully the change up front won't be a problem for the run game.  LeSean McCoy seems to excel in any scheme anyway.

 

3.  Our defense never really fit Rex Ryan's 3-4 scheme, and most of our players are very familiar with the 4-3 system.  This could be more of a return to what we do best, instead of just another scheme overhaul.

 

4.  Even if we struggle badly and lose a lot of games, that could put us in a better position for one of next year's top QBs.


Edited by mjt328, 10 May 2017 - 09:16 AM.


#18 liverpoolkev

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Posted 10 May 2017 - 09:18 AM

...and I find it amusing that posters are saying things like "give them three years and we'll see" and whatnot.

 

Yes, it's McD's first HC job, and yes, it's Beane's first GM job (although he did serve as interim GM for 10 games in 2012), but these guys are hardly "green" and the Bills' roster cupboard is far from bare.

 

I will be shocked if the Bills aren't at least a 6-7 win team, and I certainly think it's possible they could win 9 or 10.  This is not a rebuild, it's a refocus.

This is a tire fire of epic proportions . the focus is to the bottom  20 yrs not in the playoffs here we come



#19 eball

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Posted 10 May 2017 - 09:19 AM

They got rid of a half dozen of their most talented players.

 

They kept a painfully mediocre QB.

 

They have a first-time HC.

 

They have a first-time GM.

 

They are facing their toughest schedule in recent memory.

 

This is, indeed, a rebuild.  And it's about goddamn time.

 

At least with Beane being hired, it seems that McBeano will be the tandem for a few years to come.

 

I'd expect (pray/hope/beg for) a new QB next year and serious aspirations for a playoff run in 2019.

 

So the best response you have is to repeat that the HC and GM are in first-year roles?

 

How many games did Gilmore win for us?  Who are the other five players you reference?  Woods? Hurt all the time.  Gillislie?  Backup RB.  Brown? Did you watch the Pittsburgh game?

 

We'll see who is closer to being right.



#20 nucci

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Posted 10 May 2017 - 09:20 AM

Great, another 2-3 years with no playoffs?