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Worst WR corps ever? + collateral damage to DropZone Jones


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#221 Brianmoorman4jesus

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Posted 12 October 2017 - 07:26 PM

Those pic are going to somehow not be anything to worry about. Just wait a few mins. A few people will let you know why it doesnt matter. 2+years of starting, not seeing or throwing to WRs. 7 years of nfl experience...its probably going to get better real soon. Hang in there.

Edited by Brianmoorman4jesus, 12 October 2017 - 07:26 PM.


#222 Wayne Arnold

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Posted 12 October 2017 - 08:31 PM

Those pic are going to somehow not be anything to worry about. Just wait a few mins. A few people will let you know why it doesnt matter. 2+years of starting, not seeing or throwing to WRs. 7 years of nfl experience...its probably going to get better real soon. Hang in there.

 

"Every starting NFL quarterback misses wide open receivers and allows himself to get sacked after an eternity in the pocket on the first play of the final drive down one possession. LEAVE TYROD ALONE!"



#223 Brianmoorman4jesus

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Posted 12 October 2017 - 08:43 PM

I was thinking of this earlier today as a joke but then I started really thinking about the levels of it that make it an interesting thought...

What if we traded both our firsts to the Giants For Eli and their first? Then you have a qb that might actually help our team this year and next. And you also are gambling that without Eli they Finnish with the worst record in the league. And you then also move up in the draft (most likely) without the kings ransom you may need come the offseason. And you take a team that may take a qb ahead of you, out of the equation. We could potentially move up to 1 or 2 right now by doing that. And get a qb that despite recent struggles, could get us to the playoffs this season and teach the rookie we take with the giants pick.

Edited by Brianmoorman4jesus, 12 October 2017 - 08:43 PM.


#224 #BADOL

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Posted 12 October 2017 - 10:01 PM

The one time they went 1-13, Haven Moses, Marlon Briscoe, JD Hill, and Bob Chandler were all on the roster.

 

 

Yeah the Bills have almost always had decent WR at least..........until this year.

 

The level of lowered expectations from some here is amazing............this team had to call Percy out of retirement last November and last years WR were MUCH better than this years garbage.



#225 #BADOL

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Posted 12 October 2017 - 10:23 PM

My cousin sent these to me. Take from them whatever you want.  I know you can't always find the open guy and it's easy to go back on film and say he should have done this or that. But it seems there were plays to be made and he had guys running open a lot of the time. Sorry, wasn't sure whether to put this in the Tyrod thread, the All-22 thread or this one. 

 

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I take from them that there are receivers briefly open on most plays in the NFL........and that every QB doesn't see a lot of open WR's during the course of a game.

 

If you followed shows like Edge NFL matchup for years before the All-22's became available to fans........they would detail how certain QB's would have open WR's on all levels and whether their offense was successful depended greatly on which level of open WR they chose............not whether they had ONE receiver briefly open.

 

The rise of Brady over Bledsoe was all about Brady taking the high % short throws..........while Bledsoe took the lower % long shots.  

 

That was the NFL of THEN.

 

The defensive scheme the Bills employ ENCOURAGES the opposition to throw the ball to the open WR short to intermediate.........particularly in the middle of the field where they "seem" vulnerable.........because they know that at some point the average offense will make a mistake throwing the football and hopefully it becomes a turnover.

 

And that's why it works.   

 

Look at the last play in those pics.........how many times do we see the Bills defender in that position come up, disrupt the catch at arrival and the ball goes up for grabs?

 

The objective in the NFL now is bigger plays.........it's simply harder with the high % of player turnover and the lack of practice time to build the kind of offenses that can string together 10-12 play drives without making mistakes.........so when you see Tyrod waving Logan Thomas to the end zone at the risk of not getting a couple yards.......THAT is why.  

 

Teams like GB and NE are ahead of the curve because their offensive systems have been together long enough that they can take advantage of defenses designed to force shorter throws............but they are the exceptions.



#226 Coach Tuesday

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Posted 13 October 2017 - 08:32 AM

 

 

I take from them that there are receivers briefly open on most plays in the NFL........and that every QB doesn't see a lot of open WR's during the course of a game.

 

If you followed shows like Edge NFL matchup for years before the All-22's became available to fans........they would detail how certain QB's would have open WR's on all levels and whether their offense was successful depended greatly on which level of open WR they chose............not whether they had ONE receiver briefly open.

 

The rise of Brady over Bledsoe was all about Brady taking the high % short throws..........while Bledsoe took the lower % long shots.  

 

That was the NFL of THEN.

 

The defensive scheme the Bills employ ENCOURAGES the opposition to throw the ball to the open WR short to intermediate.........particularly in the middle of the field where they "seem" vulnerable.........because they know that at some point the average offense will make a mistake throwing the football and hopefully it becomes a turnover.

 

And that's why it works.   

 

Look at the last play in those pics.........how many times do we see the Bills defender in that position come up, disrupt the catch at arrival and the ball goes up for grabs?

 

The objective in the NFL now is bigger plays.........it's simply harder with the high % of player turnover and the lack of practice time to build the kind of offenses that can string together 10-12 play drives without making mistakes.........so when you see Tyrod waving Logan Thomas to the end zone at the risk of not getting a couple yards.......THAT is why.  

 

Teams like GB and NE are ahead of the curve because their offensive systems have been together long enough that they can take advantage of defenses designed to force shorter throws............but they are the exceptions.

 

All of that may be - but it seems pretty clear that McD and Dennison WANT the Bills' offense to be one of those 10-12 play/drive offenses, and they want Tyrod to move the chains and eat the clock.  The problem with those stills is that we have no idea where the coaches expected the ball to go. If Tyrod was supposed to attempt those throws and didn't, we'll know soon enough, because he'll be replaced.  



#227 Believer

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Posted 13 October 2017 - 09:09 AM

First time poster... Lifetime Bills fan... Can remember rooting for Cookie and Jack...

Live in NJ and saw this article in the NY Post front page online edition:

http://nypost.com/20...signing-public/

Veteran, Super Bowl experience, desperate to play, thinks he still can... probably sign him for a song... What would Bills have to lose giving Cruz a tryout??...

#228 #BADOL

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Posted 13 October 2017 - 12:20 PM

 

All of that may be - but it seems pretty clear that McD and Dennison WANT the Bills' offense to be one of those 10-12 play/drive offenses, and they want Tyrod to move the chains and eat the clock.  The problem with those stills is that we have no idea where the coaches expected the ball to go. If Tyrod was supposed to attempt those throws and didn't, we'll know soon enough, because he'll be replaced.  

 

 

Oh Tyrod is quite good at Jauron Ball.

 

All of the QB's that they've played would have been either 0-5 or 1-4 if they were asked to guide this team against similar counterparts.

 

McCown

Newton

Siemien

Ryan

Dalton

 

Tyrod would also be great playing the role of Randall Cunningham or Daunte Culpepper in Minnesota leading the leagues' highest scoring offense if you gave him vertical talent at WR.

 

People want him to be the ultimate QB like Aaron Rodgers or the guy with the greatest HC of all-time with the most locked-in offensive system of all time and years of wisdom like Tom Brady........he never will be.

 

That's farsightedness from fans who really don't follow the rest of the league and lack perspective on what most QB's actually bring to the table.

 

They are envious of passing yardage that Drew Brees or Big Ben or Philip Rivers put up..........but they don't care about all the mistakes those guys make and games their teams lose because they live and die by whether they are having a "good day" or not.

 

We all want our own young franchise QB but the Bills have been VERY lucky to have Tyrod........unfortunately they keep wasting the window they have where he is capable of killing defenses with his combination of a great deep ball,  good management of the football AND his athleticism..........the latter will fade in a couple seasons.


Edited by #BADOL, 13 October 2017 - 12:21 PM.


#229 jmc12290

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Posted 13 October 2017 - 12:24 PM

 

 

Oh Tyrod is quite good at Jauron Ball.

 

All of the QB's that they've played would have been either 0-5 or 1-4 if they were asked to guide this team against similar counterparts.

 

McCown

Newton

Siemien

Ryan

Dalton

 

Tyrod would also be great playing the role of Randall Cunningham or Daunte Culpepper in Minnesota leading the leagues' highest scoring offense if you gave him vertical talent at WR.

 

People want him to be the ultimate QB like Aaron Rodgers or the guy with the greatest HC of all-time with the most locked-in offensive system of all time and years of wisdom like Tom Brady........he never will be.

 

That's farsightedness from fans who really don't follow the rest of the league and lack perspective on what most QB's actually bring to the table.

 

They are envious of passing yardage that Drew Brees or Big Ben or Philip Rivers put up..........but they don't care about all the mistakes those guys make and games their teams lose because they live and die by whether they are having a "good day" or not.

 

We all want our own young franchise QB but the Bills have been VERY lucky to have Tyrod........unfortunately they keep wasting the window they have where he is capable of killing defenses with his combination of a great deep ball,  good management of the football AND his athleticism..........the latter will fade in a couple seasons.

That's because of the #rings.

 

Give me a QB who you live or die with because they can carry a team versus a guy who won't you lose you games so you can squeak into the playoffs and get rolled by a good team please.



#230 #BADOL

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Posted 13 October 2017 - 12:34 PM

That's because of the #rings.

 

Give me a QB who you live or die with because they can carry a team versus a guy who won't you lose you games so you can squeak into the playoffs and get rolled by a good team please.

 

 

Drew Brees and Rivers will have 1 ring combined for about 35 seasons in the NFL when they are done.

 

At times they've had elite talent and yet they have almost never done ANYTHING but squeak into the playoffs...........and not anytime recently.

 

Big Ben plays for the best run franchise in the SB era..........put him on SD and you have Philip Rivers..........a guy who is no longer worth having a team built AROUND.

 

So none of those future HOF QB's is dominating with the garbage at WR that Tyrod has been given to work with.

 

He's a better fit for the Bills personnel because he can get by with a lot less than those guys can.



#231 jmc12290

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Posted 13 October 2017 - 12:52 PM

 

 

Drew Brees and Rivers will have 1 ring combined for about 35 seasons in the NFL when they are done.

 

At times they've had elite talent and yet they have almost never done ANYTHING but squeak into the playoffs...........and not anytime recently.

 

Big Ben plays for the best run franchise in the SB era..........put him on SD and you have Philip Rivers..........a guy who is no longer worth having a team built AROUND.

 

So none of those future HOF QB's is dominating with the garbage at WR that Tyrod has been given to work with.

 

He's a better fit for the Bills personnel because he can get by with a lot less than those guys can.

No one could actually believe this.  

 

A better QB can get by with worse WR's.  You're denying reality.



#232 #BADOL

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Posted 13 October 2017 - 01:03 PM

No one could actually believe this.  

 

A better QB can get by with worse WR's.  You're denying reality.

 

There is a point where even a guy like Drew Brees can't survive..........and having Brandon Tate as your #1 WR is there.........it is.

 

Not saying he couldn't still throw for 300 yards most weeks but it would be 50 passes and a lot of "valiant" turnovers.

 

Big Ben would be on IR right now with the pressure he'd be seeing with no deep threat, no run game and a couple turnstiles in Mills and Ducasse and a rookie LT pass blocking for him.

 

Tyrod's ability to MAKE time and create plays on his own is a good fit for the league's worst WR/TE personnel.........which is where the Bills are right now, and have been, for much of the past two seasons.



#233 matter2003

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Posted 13 October 2017 - 01:10 PM

Just a question how did a bunch of no names do a couple years ago when Fitz (will all his flaws got the ball out on time) was QB?

Didnt last long with Fitz...they started out quickly on offense for first few weeks then would get in games where they would score and move the ball early in games and then go most of the second and third quarters without doing much of anything. Then we'd lose the lead early in the 4th and play the rest of the game trying to retake the lead but usually couldn't...

Dont you remember all those games we couldnt even hit 20 points??

Fitz had plenty of games with low passing numbers too...he also combined that with bad picks something Tyrod typically doesn't

Edited by matter2003, 13 October 2017 - 01:18 PM.


#234 buffalobloodfloridahome

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Posted 13 October 2017 - 01:35 PM

Drew Brees might be able to make Tate a Superstar. Brees, Brady, Manning and Rodgers maybe Rivers are able to elevate the WR's around them by giving them well thrown balls and allowing them to make plays. All the WRs in the NFL are capable of catching and running some are better YAC players others more possession guys. This isn't high school where there is a huge dropoff between the good and the bad. These were all high level college players at one point. I know there are some hidden gems on teams with bad QB's that may never get a chance.



#235 ndirish1978

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Posted 13 October 2017 - 01:43 PM

So Dalton didn't need green today? Just substitute Tate in there for Green.


Jones dropped more balls today.

 

If TT had Green he would be consistently over/underthrown and would be wasted. This QB is simply not competent. 



#236 jmc12290

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Posted 13 October 2017 - 01:45 PM

 

There is a point where even a guy like Drew Brees can't survive..........and having Brandon Tate as your #1 WR is there.........it is.

 

Not saying he couldn't still throw for 300 yards most weeks but it would be 50 passes and a lot of "valiant" turnovers.

 

Big Ben would be on IR right now with the pressure he'd be seeing with no deep threat, no run game and a couple turnstiles in Mills and Ducasse and a rookie LT pass blocking for him.

 

Tyrod's ability to MAKE time and create plays on his own is a good fit for the league's worst WR/TE personnel.........which is where the Bills are right now, and have been, for much of the past two seasons.

And a lot of first downs and points.  



#237 Buffalo716

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Posted 13 October 2017 - 01:58 PM

Every WR on the roster is a professional athlete.

Football has ALWAYS been about next man up and I will NEVER use injuries as an excuse

Kaelin Clay is 50x better than anyone of us and same with Tate and the likes... I have seen receivers running open so it all comes down to gelling

Excuses are what losing franchises make. Undrafted kids step up every year. It's time to step up... no more excuses

#238 OldTimeAFLGuy

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Posted 13 October 2017 - 02:19 PM

Every WR on the roster is a professional athlete.

Football has ALWAYS been about next man up and I will NEVER use injuries as an excuse

Kaelin Clay is 50x better than anyone of us and same with Tate and the likes... I have seen receivers running open so it all comes down to gelling

Excuses are what losing franchises make. Undrafted kids step up every year. It's time to step up... no more excuses

 

.....IMPOSSIBLE and flawed logic.......the TBD pundits tell me they "ALL suck"......cannot be one decent one in the whole lot, right?.....the inept passing game SOLELY rest on their shoulders....BUT...I'll ask a dumb question anyway because that's all I can muster......any idea how a WR who works his azz off off season, in minis, OTA's, pre-season etc. feels when game in and game out he runs his routes as designed to the best of his ability and rarely sees the ball when open because his QB never sees him in his limited progressions ability?......think an inkling of frustration may enter into the picture?....run your route as designed, hoping to see the ball and the best you can come up with is a wasp flying by your helmet?.....man I'd feel REAL satisfied........as much as I hope and want this Taylor kid to succeed, reads/progressions will forever be an impediment.....replace EVERY WR with a combination of FB's and TE's and pray 6 yard BOMBS keep you in the ball game.....



#239 jeremy2020

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Posted 13 October 2017 - 02:37 PM

I wish we'd just ban #badol and his "truther" rants.



#240 Buffalo716

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Posted 13 October 2017 - 02:38 PM

.....IMPOSSIBLE and flawed logic.......the TBD pundits tell me they "ALL suck"......cannot be one decent one in the whole lot, right?.....the inept passing game SOLELY rest on their shoulders....BUT...I'll ask a dumb question anyway because that's all I can muster......any idea how a WR who works his azz off off season, in minis, OTA's, pre-season etc. feels when game in and game out he runs his routes as designed to the best of his ability and rarely sees the ball when open because his QB never sees him in his limited progressions ability?......think an inkling of frustration may enter into the picture?....run your route as designed, hoping to see the ball and the best you can come up with is a wasp flying by your helmet?.....man I'd feel REAL satisfied........as much as I hope and want this Taylor kid to succeed, reads/progressions will forever be an impediment.....replace EVERY WR with a combination of FB's and TE's and pray 6 yard BOMBS keep you in the ball game.....


For sure it can be frustrating. They are professionals and want to make plays. They also need to stay professional and keep any gripes in house

I wanted to be a 20 carry a game guy and I thought I earned it. The coaches thought I was more valuable as a corner and I made a transition

I was so frustrated because I worked my ass of for years to be that guy and then I couldn't showcase it. But the team comes first and I definitely was a more complete corner so I guess the coaches were right

They just gotta keep playing